I'm using BinkleyTerm 2.60.

When not specifying an "Address" statement in Binkley.cfg the default node is Node: 1:65535/65535. However the problem is BinkleyTerm thinks there's no outbound mail ie. it reports "Nothing in Outbound Area" in the Pending Outbound
Mail window:

+- Pending Out Mail ------------+
| |
| Nothing in Outbound Area |
| |
| |
+-------------------------------+

eventhough a .cut or .flo file exists in the outbound directory.

And if I use an unlisted address BinkleyTerm exits with "System misconfigured or no entry in Nodelist":

+ 12 Sep 10:04:20 BINK begin, BinkleyTerm Version 2.60 -uSoft8.0
! 12 Sep 10:04:20 BINK No BOSS in the nodelist
! 12 Sep 10:04:20 BINK System misconfigured or no entry in Nodelist
+ 12 Sep 10:04:20 BINK end, BinkleyTerm Version 2.60 -uSoft8.0

Impersonating an existing address works.

So how do I send netmail (to my NC) if I haven't got a FidoNet address ?

Do I have to add a fake node to the nodelist and recompile the nodelist ?

--- Maximus/2 3.01
* Origin: Top Hat 2 BBS (1:343/41)

Hi Mvan,

So how do I send netmail (to my NC) if I haven't got a FidoNet address ?

If you don't have a Fidonet address then you don't have an NC, because you do not have a Nodelisting. When you wish to apply for a Node number, then your have 2 main methods you can follow -
1. Follow the method described in the Fidonet Policy4 document (this method ensurs that you HAVE read P4).
2. In some cases your local NC will provide specific additional instructions usually via other nodes within the Net.

This process requires you to -
1. Compile a Nodelist that contains the address you need to use.
2. it also demonstrates that you know how to configure your Nodelist processor.
3. Poll the node specified in P4 (or your local Network instructions).
4. You should receive further instructions on the next step.

The entire process is designed to demonstrate that you know HOW to use your Software and follow instructions.

Do I have to add a fake node to the nodelist and recompile the nodelist?

In most cases yes, but you need to check on what specifics your NC may require first.

Impersonating an existing address works.

That is considered extremely bad and could trigger alarms of malicious intent, and preclude the issuing of a Node address. It is not recommended.

When not specifying an "Address" statement in
Binkley.cfg the default node is Node: 1:65535/65535.

That is a "default" settng that does not allow you to do much other than at least see if Binkley runs. When that no. is used Binkley ignores anything in your Outbound because it knows you should have a valid address.

And if I use an unlisted address BinkleyTerm exits with
"System misconfigured or no entry in Nodelist":

Because you need to work out how to create a Nodelist that is VALID for the purposes you need.

Cheers............pk.


--- Maximus/2 3.01
* Origin: Another Good Point About OS/2 (3:772/1.10)

So how do I send netmail (to my NC) if I haven't
got a FidoNet address ?

If you don't have a Fidonet address then you don't have
an NC, because you do not have a Nodelisting. When you
wish to apply for a Node number, then your have 2 main
methods you can follow -
1. Follow the method described in the Fidonet Policy4
document (this method ensurs that you HAVE read P4).

The last time I read P4 10 years ago it said send a netmail to the NC with name, number, location, software details and wait 2 weeks for further instructions.

The last time I did that I used FrontDoor 2.12 which had no problems polling other systems using a 0:0/0 origin.

Policy 4, Section 2.2 - "How to Obtain a node number" does not require a valid node address to send netmail to the NC for a FidoNet application.

The entire process is designed to demonstrate that you
know HOW to use your Software and follow instructions.

I'm at the stage where I have everything configured, but BinkleyTerm refuses to work with an unlisted address and there isn't a configuration option to turn this restriction off, which seems counter productive to me.

Impersonating an existing address works.

That is considered extremely bad and could trigger
alarms of malicious intent, and preclude the issuing of
a Node address. It is not recommended.

0:0/0 or -1/-1 shouldn't / can't be routed as echomail anyway so I don't know what the fuss is about.

When not specifying an "Address" statement in
Binkley.cfg the default node is Node: 1:65535/65535.

That is a "default" settng that does not allow you to
do much other than at least see if Binkley runs. When
that no. is used Binkley ignores anything in your
Outbound because it knows you should have a valid
address.

I might look into BinkD and bypass BinkleyTerm altogether.

Nobody uses dialup anymore.

I just waned BinkleyTerm to show me what's waiting in the outbound area so I could verify the packing process, and study how BSO worked. I don't really need
it to send mail. It just looks good. I'll just use BinkD.

And if I use an unlisted address BinkleyTerm exits with
"System misconfigured or no entry in Nodelist":

Because you need to work out how to create a Nodelist
that is VALID for the purposes you need.

That seems strange to me because that sounds like the NC's job.

The applicant shouldn't be tampering with the nodelist.

:)

--- Maximus/2 3.01
* Origin: Top Hat 2 BBS (1:343/41)

Hi! Mvan,

In a message to Peter Knapper you wrote:

Policy 4, Section 2.2 - "How to Obtain a node number" does not
require a valid node address to send netmail to the NC for a FidoNet application.

What happens if you use a 1:343/999 -aka- instead? (Or, insert your nearest NC's Net number... for the purposes of the exercise.)

Cheers,
Paul.

--- Radius 4.010/21.01.2005(Final)
* Origin: Operator, trace this call and tell me where I am. (3:640/384)

Hi! Mvan,

In a message to Peter Knapper you wrote:

Policy 4, Section 2.2 - "How to Obtain a node number" does not
require a valid node address to send netmail to the NC for a FidoNet application.

What happens if you use a 1:343/999 -aka- instead?
(Or, insert your nearest NC's Net number... for the
purposes of the exercise.)

Unless the procedure's to use node 999 ...

Nope. BinkleyTerm refuses to operate with an unlisted address.

From my understanding if it's a valid address then it might get routed. But 0:0/0 or -/-1 or even 1:65535/65535 shouldn't, and the destination system's mail processor should place those messages to a defined BAD_AREA.

The applicant would then contact their NC by phone to let them know mail's waiting. Or they could simply wait until the NC inspects their BAD_AREA.

For the purpose of applying for a node address, an applicant should only need to demonstrate that their system can send Netmail.

--- Maximus/2 3.01
* Origin: Top Hat 2 BBS (1:343/41)

Hi! Mvan,

On Wed, 13 Sep 06, you wrote to me:

Policy 4, Section 2.2 - "How to Obtain a node number" does not

[ ...trimmed.. ]

What happens if you use a 1:343/999 -aka- instead?
(Or, insert your nearest NC's Net number... for the
purposes of the exercise.)

Unless the procedure's to use node 999 ...

That's the intent of P4, surely.

Nope. BinkleyTerm refuses to operate with an unlisted address.

Apparently from your testing, then, it appears that BT does _not_ comply with P4 and should not be used. Mmm.

From my understanding if it's a valid address then it might get
routed. But 0:0/0 or -/-1 or even 1:65535/65535 shouldn't, and the destination system's mail processor should place those messages to a defined BAD_AREA.

It (node/999 outbound) ought to route to the NC. There's no problem there, if it's ever delivered (marked as 'direct' flavour).

The applicant would then contact their NC by phone to let them know
mail's waiting. Or they could simply wait until the NC inspects their BAD_AREA.
For the purpose of applying for a node address, an applicant should
only need to demonstrate that their system can send Netmail.

I never had to phone no stinking NC. The first time I did was just a few years
back, to organise a sysop piss-up.

In your case, and if you can do BinkD, then I suggest you try a BSO-style mailer that can do both dial-up and IP like: Argus or Radius (forget about Taurus as it's dead-meat, now). Being more modern software I'm sure they (it, in reality) won't have a silly need to modify your local copy of the nodelist, just get them (it) to execute to 'waiting for caller' mode.

Cheers,
Paul.

--- Radius 4.010/21.01.2005(Final)
* Origin: Fuor yeers argo i cudnot spel occifer; nkow i are won. (3:640/384)

Hi Mvan,

So how do I send netmail (to my NC) if I haven't
got a FidoNet address ?

The simplest way is to log into any BBS as a user and ask........;-)

Policy 4, Section 2.2 - "How to Obtain a node number"
does not require a valid node address to send netmail
to the NC for a FidoNet application.

You may note that further down that same section its does say that some Networks have specific instructions. Its my experience that MOST Networks have specific instructions.

The entire process is designed to demonstrate that you
know HOW to use your Software and follow instructions.

I'm at the stage where I have everything configured,
but BinkleyTerm refuses
to work with an unlisted address and there isn't a
configuration option to
turn this restriction off, which seems counter
productive to me.

See further on on how to solve that.

And if I use an unlisted address BinkleyTerm exits with
"System misconfigured or no entry in Nodelist":

Because you need to work out how to create a Nodelist
that is VALID for the purposes you need.

That seems strange to me because that sounds like the NC's job.

No... you have missed one important part.

The applicant shouldn't be tampering with the nodelist.

No he shouldn't, but the important part is that as the Nodelist is almost NEVER
used raw, it is always complied, and the compilation process allows you to ADD specific Details concerning -
1. Phone numbers for existing nodes,
2. Session passwords for existing nodes,
3. Details concerning NEW nodes not listed in the standrd Nodelist,
4. Special operating instructions (EG special Modem configuration parameters,
etc).

A node never EXPORTS a RAW Nodelist so no-one else sees your COMPILED version of the nodelist, and as long as it contains your OWN specific temporary details
that you are using, BinkelyTerm is happy.

The reason for this is that if you set up Session Level passwords for any of your Links, the passwords HAVE to be entered into your COMPILED Nodelist, and its the Compiling process that does this.

I strongly recommend that you contact someone in your Net and ask them what specific Network details you might need, because if you miss them or get them wrong your request may never be seen by the right people.

For example, here in Net 3:772 our specific instructions advise you to - 1. Configure your Mailer at address 3:772/99.
2. Then Poll the NC (3:772/0 using the Nodelist entry) for the next step.
3. The NC's system is configured to then send a Netmail to 3:772/99 with further instructions
4. Those instructions advise you perform certain functions and REPLY to the NC with YOUR system set as 3:772/999. You then wait for a reply.
5. If those steps worked then you will receive a reply from the NC with either a request for more info or details regarding your assigned Fidonet node number.

I am not the NC, however if anyone calls here as 3:772/99, my system will resond advising they have contacted the WRONG Node, and what steps they need to
take to contact the correct node.

All of this is designed as a test that demonstrates you know how to configure and operate your Node at the most basic level, so that you effectively confirm you are capable of interacting with other Fidonet members. This network has operated this way for as long as I can remember (going back to 1989 or so...).

I hope this helps...............pk.


--- Maximus/2 3.01
* Origin: Another Good Point About OS/2 (3:772/1.10)

[...]

The entire process is designed to demonstrate that you
know HOW to use your Software and follow instructions.

I'm at the stage where I have everything configured,
but BinkleyTerm refuses
to work with an unlisted address and there isn't a
configuration option to
turn this restriction off, which seems counter
productive to me.

See further on on how to solve that.

Your reply has led me to notice that bt-ref.txt mentions
that if BossPwd and BossPhone are used together, a nodelist
is not required:

BossPwd <password>

Used for Point installations, this statement designates
the password to be used for session-level passwording

[...]

When this statement AND 'BossPhone' are BOTH
implemented, a nodelist is NOT required for a Point
system.

[...]

No he shouldn't, but the important part is that as the
Nodelist is almost NEVER used raw, it is always complied,
and the compilation process allows you to ADD specific
Details concerning -
1. Phone numbers for existing nodes,
2. Session passwords for existing nodes,
3. Details concerning NEW nodes not listed in the standrd Nodelist,
4. Special operating instructions (EG special Modem
configuration parameters, etc).

What nodelist editor do I use for this ?

I heard people were using Makenl.

A node never EXPORTS a RAW Nodelist so no-one else sees your COMPILED version of the nodelist, and as long as it contains your OWN
specific temporary details that you are using, BinkelyTerm is happy.

The reason for this is that if you set up Session Level
passwords for any of your Links, the passwords HAVE to be
entered into your COMPILED Nodelist, and its the Compiling
process that does this.

The simplest way is to enable BossPwd and BossPhone in Binkley.cfg.

You'd only need to get involved with nodelist if connected to
multiple networks.

Even then it doesn't feel right. Session passwords should be
configured in the mailer imo.

[...]

For example, here in Net 3:772 our specific instructions
advise you to - 1. Configure your Mailer at address
3:772/99.
2. Then Poll the NC (3:772/0 using the Nodelist entry) for the next
step. 3. The NC's system is configured to then send a Netmail
to 3:772/99 with further instructions
4. Those instructions advise you perform certain
functions and REPLY to the NC with YOUR system set as
3:772/999. You then wait for a reply.
5. If those steps worked then you will receive a reply from the NC
with either a request for more info or details regarding your
assigned Fidonet node number.

Geeze that seems pretty long winded.

When I had FidoNet all we had to do was pack the password with each
message using Squish.

I am not the NC, however if anyone calls here as 3:772/99,
my system will resond advising they have contacted the
WRONG Node, and what steps they need to take to contact the
correct node.

What mailer are you using ?


... DOS never says "EXCELLENT command or filename"...
___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30

--- Maximus 3.01
* Origin: The Dog House * Orillia ON Canada * bbs.doghousebbs.com (1:229/1394)