• Re: Gun Insurance

    From Thumper@THEWASTE to All on Friday, June 17, 2022 09:59:00
    Sacramento, CA A bill is up for debate at the California state capitol that would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    It would cover the damages that occur from the accidental or negligent use of firearms. The bill is authored by Democratic Senator Nancy Skinner, who says it models a new law approved this year by the City of San Jose. She says it is the same idea as purchasing insurance for a vehicle. Lawmakers in the state of New York are considering a similar law.

    It is opposed by gun rights groups, like the Gun Owners of California. The organization argues that no insurance companies will cover the misuse of firearms and that it also infringes on Constitutional rights.

    A second gun-related bill, authored by Democrat Marc Levine, would place a new tax on firearm purchases, totaling around 10-percent. It would raise an estimated $118-million that would be allocated for gun violence prevention programs.


    ... If a sloth were to clap, it will always sound sarcastic.
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  • From Ford Prefect@FORTY2 to Thumper on Friday, June 17, 2022 13:26:53
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Thumper to All on Fri Jun 17 2022 09:59 am

    Sacramento, CA ¡ A bill is up for debate at the California state capitol that would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    Okay. If this goes through, will this then permit any gun owner to use magazines that hold more than 10 rounds and/or purchase firearms that support magazines that hold more than 10?

    I doubt it.

    Brian Klauss <-> Ford Prefect
    42bytes a Synchronet BBS =========> 42bytes.net

    ---
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  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Thumper on Friday, June 17, 2022 15:20:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Thumper to All on Fri Jun 17 2022 09:59 am

    Sacramento, CA ¡ A bill is up for debate at the California state capitol tha would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    It would cover the damages that occur from the accidental or negligent use o firearms. The bill is authored by Democratic Senator Nancy Skinner, who says models a new law approved this year by the City of San Jose. She says it is same idea as purchasing insurance for a vehicle. Lawmakers in the state of N York are considering a similar law.

    It is opposed by gun rights groups, like the Gun Owners of California. The organization argues that no insurance companies will cover the misuse of firearms and that it also infringes on Constitutional rights.

    A second gun-related bill, authored by Democrat Marc Levine, would place a n tax on firearm purchases, totaling around 10-percent. It would raise an estimated $118-million that would be allocated for gun violence prevention programs.


    ... If a sloth were to clap, it will always sound sarcastic.

    Sounds like two new schemes to move the prices of firearms further from the hands of regular citizens. Th einsurance policy is a punitive law, since not having insurance would allow someone to sue your pants off, or raise your
    rates until you legally cannot own a firearm.

    Makes me wonder if a registry is also required in order to set rates based on what you own? Who all has access to the registry?

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Ford Prefect on Saturday, June 18, 2022 13:11:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Ford Prefect to Thumper on Fri Jun 17 2022 01:26 pm

    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Thumper to All on Fri Jun 17 2022 09:59 am

    Sacramento, CA ¡ A bill is up for debate at the California state capitol that would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    Okay. If this goes through, will this then permit any gun owner to use maga

    I doubt it.

    Brian Klauss <-> Ford Prefect
    42bytes a Synchronet BBS =========> 42bytes.net


    If it did allow magazines over 10 rounds, there may be a registry to
    determine whether they are common to that model, or higher rates if they do
    not fit flush or are considered "standard" for the firearm. Larger magazines depending on the firearm. You may have to cover each mag under it's own polic y. Imagine what a 3-gun or multi-gun competitor who uses 60 round
    Shur-fire mags and owns several then several mags for their pistols and an extended tube on their shotgun would have to pay?

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Dr. What@DMINE to Thumper on Sunday, June 19, 2022 09:57:00
    Thumper wrote to All <=-

    Sacramento, CA ¡ A bill is up for debate at the California state
    capitol that would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    Sounds like mandatory gun registration to me. (Most places only require that you register hand guns. Long guns are usually exempt.)

    That's the first step toward gun confiscation.


    ... ALL bikini clad women, proceed to move to California.
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  • From Dr. What@DMINE to Moondog on Sunday, June 19, 2022 09:58:00
    Moondog wrote to Thumper <=-

    Sounds like two new schemes to move the prices of firearms further from the hands of regular citizens.

    It wouldn't be the first time they tried that.

    "We aren't taking away anyone's right. But if you want to own gun-type-X, you have to get a license from the state, which costs prohibitively high and no one can afford."


    ... I'm not a complete idiot - several parts are missing.
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  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dr. What on Sunday, June 19, 2022 16:39:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dr. What to Moondog on Sun Jun 19 2022 09:58 am

    Moondog wrote to Thumper <=-

    Sounds like two new schemes to move the prices of firearms further from the hands of regular citizens.

    It wouldn't be the first time they tried that.

    "We aren't taking away anyone's right. But if you want to own gun-type-X, y have to get a license from the state, which costs prohibitively high and no can afford."


    ... I'm not a complete idiot - several parts are missing.

    And while they are doing it, they keep on telling people it's a state's
    right, not an individual right.

    Illinois already has what they call an FOID (firearms ownership ID) and you can't even touch a gun in a gun shop, let alone buy one. Imagine having to call your insurance company to get rates, then find out they're going to
    charge extra because you're looking at a Mossberg 500 with a synthetic stock and phosphate finish versus the model with the blued finish and wood hardare.
    Your rates will be different based on "scary" features.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Arelor@PALANT to Thumper on Monday, June 20, 2022 09:23:54
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Thumper to All on Fri Jun 17 2022 09:59 am

    A second gun-related bill, authored by Democrat Marc Levine, would place a new
    tax on firearm purchases, totaling around 10-percent. It would raise an estimated $118-million that would be allocated for gun violence prevention programs.

    So gun owners will pay a tax whose money will be used to campaign against gun owners.

    Awesome. Not.

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

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  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to MOONDOG on Monday, June 20, 2022 17:10:00
    And while they are doing it, they keep on telling people it's a state's right, not an individual right.

    Which it is not because it is covered in the Bill of Rights, where "state's rights" are the ones not covered in the Constitution or its amendments, per
    the 10th Amendment.

    Illinois already has what they call an FOID (firearms ownership ID) and you can't even touch a gun in a gun shop, let alone buy one. Imagine having to call your insurance company to get rates, then find out they're going to charge extra because you're looking at a Mossberg 500 with a synthetic stock and phosphate finish versus the model with the blued finish and wood hardare.
    Your rates will be different based on "scary" features.

    No doubt. :(


    * SLMR 2.1a * "Don't touch me...I'll wound your inner child!" - Beavis

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  • From Tracker1@TRN to Moondog on Tuesday, June 21, 2022 13:21:51
    On 6/17/22 12:20, Moondog wrote:

    Makes me wonder if a registry is also required in order to set
    rates based on what you own? Who all has access to the registry?

    I think it would be a defacto registry even if via the insurance
    companies sharing information, then sharing with data harvestors, then
    the govt just buys the data from them, like the FBI and other agencies
    already do.

    Probably worse than a registry, because they also have a lot of
    correlated data.
    --
    Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com
    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Tracker1 on Thursday, June 23, 2022 11:52:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Tracker1 to Moondog on Tue Jun 21 2022 01:21 pm

    On 6/17/22 12:20, Moondog wrote:

    Makes me wonder if a registry is also required in order to set
    rates based on what you own? Who all has access to the registry?

    I think it would be a defacto registry even if via the insurance
    companies sharing information, then sharing with data harvestors, then
    the govt just buys the data from them, like the FBI and other agencies already do.

    Probably worse than a registry, because they also have a lot of
    correlated data.
    --
    Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com


    The worst thing about all this is the deception of why it is being done. Michigan has a handgun registry. For several years, you had to pick up a ppurchase permit to buy a handgun, then within ten days of purchase, take it
    to your local police department (or county building if live in a township)
    and have a "safety" inspection done. At this time the model and serial
    number was registered as a means to track it if it was stolen. I went with a friend when he got his Ruger Blackhawk .44 inspected, and all the police
    chief did was fondle the gun, ask him why he "needed" a cannon, then offered
    to buy it from him because he liked it too.

    Going through the county was a crazier adventure. A buddy bought a Tec-22 in the mid 1990's, and the "inspection clerk" knew very little about firearms.
    He gave her the pistol unloaded with no magazine. he had two magazines for
    it - a ten round Ruger rotary mag for a 10-22, and a Ramline 25 round magazine . She freaked when she saw the 25 round magazine, then called another
    officer over to look at my friend's "machine pistol." The other officer
    chilled her ass down and said everything was fine. The paperwork was done,
    and we left with no problems.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@REALITY to Tracker1 on Wednesday, June 22, 2022 07:56:00
    Tracker1 wrote to Moondog <=-

    Probably worse than a registry, because they also have a lot of
    correlated data.

    Better, if you need to compile a list of AR-15 owners who make between 45K
    and 65K, rent an apartment and like furry porn, that is.


    ... Landru! Guide us!
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  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to TRACKER1 on Thursday, June 23, 2022 16:48:00

    Makes me wonder if a registry is also required in order to set
    rates based on what you own? Who all has access to the registry?

    I think it would be a defacto registry even if via the insurance
    companies sharing information, then sharing with data harvestors, then
    the govt just buys the data from them, like the FBI and other agencies already do.

    Probably worse than a registry, because they also have a lot of
    correlated data.

    You are right, it would all likely be shared with data harvestors. People could use your gun ownership to draw all sorts of profiles up about you.

    Someone who frequents an echo on another network would say that this is
    part of the choice you have to make and, if you don't want your data known
    you should not have guns. They also believe that law abiding citizens
    having guns is what makes law breaking persons use them.


    * SLMR 2.1a * 2 + 2 = 5 for extremely small values of 5.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Thursday, June 23, 2022 21:36:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to TRACKER1 on Thu Jun 23 2022 04:48 pm


    Makes me wonder if a registry is also required in order to set
    rates based on what you own? Who all has access to the registry?

    I think it would be a defacto registry even if via the insurance
    companies sharing information, then sharing with data harvestors, then
    the govt just buys the data from them, like the FBI and other agencies already do.

    Probably worse than a registry, because they also have a lot of
    correlated data.

    You are right, it would all likely be shared with data harvestors. People could use your gun ownership to draw all sorts of profiles up about you.

    Someone who frequents an echo on another network would say that this is
    part of the choice you have to make and, if you don't want your data known you should not have guns. They also believe that law abiding citizens having guns is what makes law breaking persons use them.


    * SLMR 2.1a * 2 + 2 = 5 for extremely small values of 5.


    That's the same logic that says sprinkler systems and fire extinguishers are installed to tempt arsonists.

    Predators do not go after animals they fear.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Thursday, June 23, 2022 23:28:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Tracker1 on Wed Jun 22 2022 07:56 am

    Tracker1 wrote to Moondog <=-

    Probably worse than a registry, because they also have a lot of correlated data.

    Better, if you need to compile a list of AR-15 owners who make between 45K and 65K, rent an apartment and like furry porn, that is.


    ... Landru! Guide us!

    Having the government knowing which doors to kick down when they turn against the people is one thing. Imagine being treated like leper or be discriminated because you own firearms? It may not be their business what you own as long
    as it's legal and safe (or an indvidual right,) but some may show their disapproval by raisng rates or making services unavailable to you. Vote with your wallet only goes so far with some products.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to MOONDOG on Friday, June 24, 2022 17:10:00
    Someone who frequents an echo on another network would say that this is part of the choice you have to make and, if you don't want your data known you should not have guns. They also believe that law abiding citizens having guns is what makes law breaking persons use them.


    That's the same logic that says sprinkler systems and fire extinguishers are installed to tempt arsonists.

    Predators do not go after animals they fear.

    Exactly. I may not have worded it exactly right. I think they believe
    that law abiding citizens having guns means there are more guns out there
    for law breaking persons to have access to (while breaking the law). Their belief is that we should be willing to give up our guns, or at least have
    ours all registered, tracked, and restricted (as to what we can own) so
    that criminals cannot get their hands on them. <rollseyes>

    I do agree that most law breaking persons are not going to try anything if
    they think they might get shot. Many of them are not smart, but I don't believe that most of them have a death wish.


    * SLMR 2.1a * The number you have dailed...9-1-1...has been changed...

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  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Saturday, June 25, 2022 12:35:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to MOONDOG on Fri Jun 24 2022 05:10 pm

    Someone who frequents an echo on another network would say that this is part of the choice you have to make and, if you don't want your data kn you should not have guns. They also believe that law abiding citizens having guns is what makes law breaking persons use them.


    That's the same logic that says sprinkler systems and fire extinguishers a installed to tempt arsonists.

    Predators do not go after animals they fear.

    Exactly. I may not have worded it exactly right. I think they believe
    that law abiding citizens having guns means there are more guns out there for law breaking persons to have access to (while breaking the law). Their belief is that we should be willing to give up our guns, or at least have ours all registered, tracked, and restricted (as to what we can own) so
    that criminals cannot get their hands on them. <rollseyes>

    I do agree that most law breaking persons are not going to try anything if they think they might get shot. Many of them are not smart, but I don't believe that most of them have a death wish.


    * SLMR 2.1a * The number you have dailed...9-1-1...has been changed...


    It can be a mixed bag. The other day someone was buying handguns for he and his wife. Hios wife works in a marijuana dispensary and handles large sums
    of cash, and was asking if open carry might be preferable over concealed
    carry, which would take longer to get a permit.

    I told them a visible firearm is like a flashlight in a dark room. You can
    see your enemies, but they can see you have a flashlight. While it should discourage bad actors, it also singles you out as the biggest threat to take out first. Concealed carry keeps everybody guessing. And polite.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Arelor@PALANT to Moondog on Sunday, June 26, 2022 10:58:31
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Moondog to Dumas Walker on Sat Jun 25 2022 12:35 pm

    I told them a visible firearm is like a flashlight in a dark room. You can see your enemies, but they can see you have a flashlight. While it should discourage bad actors, it also singles you out as the biggest threat to take out first. Concealed carry keeps everybody guessing. And polite.


    The advantage of open carry is that it normalizes having a gun. If half the population carries
    a gun but they are all concealed, then the population and politicians may perceive that gun
    owners are a tiny minority (after all, nobody sees them anymore, therefore they must not
    exist!)

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Arelor on Sunday, June 26, 2022 17:35:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Arelor to Moondog on Sun Jun 26 2022 10:58 am

    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Moondog to Dumas Walker on Sat Jun 25 2022 12:35 pm

    I told them a visible firearm is like a flashlight in a dark room. You c see your enemies, but they can see you have a flashlight. While it shoul discourage bad actors, it also singles you out as the biggest threat to t out first. Concealed carry keeps everybody guessing. And polite.


    The advantage of open carry is that it normalizes having a gun. If half the a gun but they are all concealed, then the population and politicians may pe owners are a tiny minority (after all, nobody sees them anymore, therefore t exist!)

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken


    I agree on the concept, but not the execution. If everyone open carried, the day you're caught alone without it would be the time you become a target. Concealed carry keeps the bad guys guessing. The was a gas station robbery a few years ago, and one of the customers standing in line was open carrying. The line was cramped because the entry way was constricted,and the robber singled him out and got in line behind him and held a knife to his back. He had a retention holster, so the robber could not pull it out easily, however the robber threatened him and he relased the retention button. Even if the
    guy didn't have a knife or other weapon, they were in such enclosed space
    that pulling the gun would've been hard without special gun retention and
    close in training (which he didn't have.) Some open carry folks think a gun
    is a magic talisman that wards away evil. It's knowing how to safely and efficiently let out the smoke of the talisman that does the damage.


    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From JIMMY ANDERSON@OTHETA to DR. WHAT on Sunday, June 26, 2022 13:51:00
    DR. WHAT wrote to THUMPER <=-

    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <62AF2C20.2234.dove-firearms@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <62ACB593.577.dove-firearms@wastelands-bbs.net>
    Thumper wrote to All <=-

    Sacramento, CA ¡ A bill is up for debate at the California state
    capitol that would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    Sounds like mandatory gun registration to me. (Most places only
    require that you register hand guns. Long guns are usually exempt.)

    That's the first step toward gun confiscation.

    There is no registration here in Tennessee...




    ... My wife accused me of being lazy. I told her I had done NOTHING!
    --- MultiMail/Mac v0.52
    ■ wcQWK 8.0 ≈ Omicron Theta * Cordova, TN * winserver.org
  • From Belly@BRAZINET to JIMMY ANDERSON on Wednesday, June 29, 2022 10:47:05
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: JIMMY ANDERSON to DR. WHAT on Sun Jun 26 2022 01:51 pm

    Hi, Jimmy... I think we might know one another in RL.

    o
    (O)
    BeLLy

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ bbs.brazi.net ■ www.brazi.net ■ WARNING: May contain nuts
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to JIMMY ANDERSON on Tuesday, June 28, 2022 16:15:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: JIMMY ANDERSON to DR. WHAT on Sun Jun 26 2022 01:51 pm

    DR. WHAT wrote to THUMPER <=-

    @VIA: DMINE
    @MSGID: <62AF2C20.2234.dove-firearms@dmine.net>
    @REPLY: <62ACB593.577.dove-firearms@wastelands-bbs.net>
    Thumper wrote to All <=-

    Sacramento, CA ¡ A bill is up for debate at the California state capitol that would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    Sounds like mandatory gun registration to me. (Most places only require that you register hand guns. Long guns are usually exempt.)

    That's the first step toward gun confiscation.

    There is no registration here in Tennessee...


    That is why they try to sneak it in under the context of other laws. During the drafting of the 1934 National Firearms act, a registration plan was part o f the original language of the bill. This addition was based on how well Germany was doing with their own registration programs.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to Moondog on Monday, July 04, 2022 01:32:00
    Moondog wrote to Dumas Walker <=-



    Exactly. I may not have worded it exactly right. I think they believe
    that law abiding citizens having guns means there are more guns out there for law breaking persons to have access to (while breaking the law). Their belief is that we should be willing to give up our guns, or at least have ours all registered, tracked, and restricted (as to what we can own) so
    that criminals cannot get their hands on them. <rollseyes>

    I do agree that most law breaking persons are not going to try anything if they think they might get shot. Many of them are not smart, but I don't believe that most of them have a death wish.


    * SLMR 2.1a * The number you have dailed...9-1-1...has been changed...


    It can be a mixed bag. The other day someone was buying handguns for
    he and his wife. Hios wife works in a marijuana dispensary and handles large sums of cash, and was asking if open carry might be preferable
    over concealed carry, which would take longer to get a permit.

    I told them a visible firearm is like a flashlight in a dark room. You can see your enemies, but they can see you have a flashlight. While it should discourage bad actors, it also singles you out as the biggest threat to take out first. Concealed carry keeps everybody guessing.
    And polite.

    ---
    = Synchronet = The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net

    Criminals are cowards by nature. If they perceive even the slightest chance at an armed repsonse, they'll back down. I open carry, mainly because concealed carry is too slow, too uncomfortable and restricts my choice of options. I prefer to have my SW 645, 1911 or PT-145 Pro (which I COULD carry concealed) over any of my subcompact .380 or 9mm options any day. I carry .45 primary, but backup with .380 or 9mm compacts. If I'm going into a place where open carry is disallowed, I always have the backup.

    Of course, I live in Wyoming. In Wyoming one must assume that at least 50% of those around you are carrying, concealed or open. Hmmm... funny thing.. I just realized.... I hear a lot fewer news stories regarding armed robbery here in WY than I did when I lived in NY. Geee...... I wonder why?

    ... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to Arelor on Monday, July 04, 2022 01:39:00
    Arelor wrote to Moondog <=-


    The advantage of open carry is that it normalizes having a gun. If half the population carries a gun but they are all concealed, then the population and politicians may perceive that gun owners are a tiny minority (after all, nobody sees them anymore, therefore they must not exist!)

    For me the primary benefit is ease of access and an increase in carry options. Carrying concealed usally means you have to adjust at least one piece of clothing to access the firearm, increasing the chance of a snag or a tangle or some other obstruction. Also it is more difficult to comfortably carry a full size pistol so one usually tends to resort to a compact or sub-compact. Nothing wrong with using those for defense, but I prefer the option of using my full size SW 645 or 1911 for defense. Hell, where I live I could openly carry my 6" GP-100 and nobody would blink an eye except to ask how I like it!

    Then again, I DO remember the day I saw a fellow carring a .454 Raging Bull in an Uncle Mike's ballistic nylon holster. Having one of those bitches myself and knowing what it's like to shoot, I'd have definitely opted for something different.

    ... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to Moondog on Monday, July 04, 2022 01:45:00
    Moondog wrote to Arelor <=-


    I agree on the concept, but not the execution. If everyone open
    carried, the day you're caught alone without it would be the time you become a target. Concealed carry keeps the bad guys guessing. The was
    a gas station robbery a few years ago, and one of the customers
    standing in line was open carrying. The line was cramped because the
    entry way was constricted,and the robber singled him out and got in
    line behind him and held a knife to his back. He had a retention
    holster, so the robber could not pull it out easily, however the robber threatened him and he relased the retention button. Even if the guy didn't have a knife or other weapon, they were in such enclosed space
    that pulling the gun would've been hard without special gun retention
    and close in training (which he didn't have.) Some open carry folks
    think a gun is a magic talisman that wards away evil. It's knowing how
    to safely and efficiently let out the smoke of the talisman that does
    the damage.


    I prefer open carry, and I realize that it's not some sort of "talisamn" that wards off evil. Believe me. When I'm in public, my head is on a swivel and I know what everyone around me is up to, and I do not allow myself to be in a compromised position.

    As I say... Carry. I don't care how, why, or what. Just carry. If you prefer concealed carry, that's up to you, but I sure as hell expect your backup if I get in a bad situation because I prefer to carry in the open!

    ... Got my tie caught in the fax... Suddenly I was in L.A.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to JIMMY ANDERSON on Monday, July 04, 2022 01:47:00
    JIMMY ANDERSON wrote to DR. WHAT <=-

    @MSGID: <62BB157D.3580.dove-gun@vert.synchro.net>
    DR. WHAT wrote to THUMPER <=-
    arms@wastelands-bbs.net>
    Thumper wrote to All <=-

    Sacramento, CA ¡ A bill is up for debate at the California state
    capitol that would mandate gun owners purchase liability insurance.

    Sounds like mandatory gun registration to me. (Most places only
    require that you register hand guns. Long guns are usually exempt.)

    That's the first step toward gun confiscation.

    There is no registration here in Tennessee...

    Nor here in the free state of Wyoming. One of the primary reasons for my moving here from New York and thereby increasing my collection considerably. Suffice it to say, if I were to move back to New York my collection would make me a felon many times over.

    ... Computer Hacker wanted. Must have own axe.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to Moondog on Monday, July 04, 2022 01:50:00
    Moondog wrote to JIMMY ANDERSON <=-



    That is why they try to sneak it in under the context of other laws. During the drafting of the 1934 National Firearms act, a registration
    plan was part o f the original language of the bill. This addition was based on how well Germany was doing with their own registration
    programs.

    Reason enough to make resisting ANY gun registration legislation important. Remember, we are celebrating Independence Day because and ARMED populace refused to disarm themselves. You never know when a SECOND Independence Day may be necessary.
    ... There are 10 kinds of people. Those who get binary and those who don't.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Weatherman on Tuesday, July 05, 2022 10:57:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Weatherman to Arelor on Mon Jul 04 2022 01:39 am

    Arelor wrote to Moondog <=-


    The advantage of open carry is that it normalizes having a gun. If half the population carries a gun but they are all concealed, then the population and politicians may perceive that gun owners are a tiny minority (after all, nobody sees them anymore, therefore they must not exist!)

    For me the primary benefit is ease of access and an increase in carry option Carrying concealed usally means you have to adjust at least one piece of clothing to access the firearm, increasing the chance of a snag or a tangle some other obstruction. Also it is more difficult to comfortably carry a fu size pistol so one usually tends to resort to a compact or sub-compact. Nothing wrong with using those for defense, but I prefer the option of using full size SW 645 or 1911 for defense. Hell, where I live I could openly car my 6" GP-100 and nobody would blink an eye except to ask how I like it!

    Then again, I DO remember the day I saw a fellow carring a .454 Raging Bull an Uncle Mike's ballistic nylon holster. Having one of those bitches myself and knowing what it's like to shoot, I'd have definitely opted for something different.

    ... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.

    I've seen shirts and coats that were designed to be concealed carry friendly.
    The shirts would have snaps that would allow you to push through a slot in
    the garment to reach a firearm, and the jackets were designed the same way.

    Concealed carry requires learning technique and gaining muscle memory to draw smoothly.

    I couldn't imagine carrying a Raging Bull for anything other than intimidation.
    Too much barrel if you end up on the ground in a fight, and have to pull the gun and stuff it in someone's side to get them off you. With a standard or compact pistol, that type of action would be much easier to pull off, like jamming a fist in their side. A person can cover 21 feet in less than 3 seconds. If a person's body language doesn't telegraph any danger, chances
    are you may have to draw while wrestling a person.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Weatherman on Tuesday, July 05, 2022 11:02:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Weatherman to Moondog on Mon Jul 04 2022 01:45 am

    Moondog wrote to Arelor <=-


    I agree on the concept, but not the execution. If everyone open carried, the day you're caught alone without it would be the time you become a target. Concealed carry keeps the bad guys guessing. The was a gas station robbery a few years ago, and one of the customers standing in line was open carrying. The line was cramped because the entry way was constricted,and the robber singled him out and got in line behind him and held a knife to his back. He had a retention holster, so the robber could not pull it out easily, however the robber threatened him and he relased the retention button. Even if the guy didn't have a knife or other weapon, they were in such enclosed space that pulling the gun would've been hard without special gun retention and close in training (which he didn't have.) Some open carry folks think a gun is a magic talisman that wards away evil. It's knowing how to safely and efficiently let out the smoke of the talisman that does the damage.


    I prefer open carry, and I realize that it's not some sort of "talisamn" tha wards off evil. Believe me. When I'm in public, my head is on a swivel an know what everyone around me is up to, and I do not allow myself to be in a compromised position.

    As I say... Carry. I don't care how, why, or what. Just carry. If you prefer concealed carry, that's up to you, but I sure as hell expect your bac if I get in a bad situation because I prefer to carry in the open!

    ... Got my tie caught in the fax... Suddenly I was in L.A.

    I emphasize training before any form of carrying. As mentioned, if you carry
    a gun as a talisman and cannot keep a hold on it, you might as well give it
    to the bad guy. i agree about sitautional awareness. Do not set yourself up to fail and find yourself being funneled into a crowd of people or tight
    space where it may be hard to draw or fight back.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Weatherman on Tuesday, July 05, 2022 11:12:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Weatherman to Moondog on Mon Jul 04 2022 01:50 am

    Moondog wrote to JIMMY ANDERSON <=-



    That is why they try to sneak it in under the context of other laws. During the drafting of the 1934 National Firearms act, a registration plan was part o f the original language of the bill. This addition was based on how well Germany was doing with their own registration programs.

    Reason enough to make resisting ANY gun registration legislation important. Remember, we are celebrating Independence Day because and ARMED populace refused to disarm themselves. You never know when a SECOND Independence Day may be necessary.
    ... There are 10 kinds of people. Those who get binary and those who don't.

    When my liberal cousin recently told me we don't need guns because we have police and military, I painted a scenario based on January 6th where a former president refuses to step down, and has a combination of federal forces and a private army of loyalists under their command. It could've happened 200
    years ago, and it could happen today.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From DaiTengu@ENSEMBLE to Weatherman on Thursday, July 07, 2022 09:55:44
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Weatherman to Moondog on Mon Jul 04 2022 01:32 am

    Of course, I live in Wyoming. In Wyoming one must assume that at least 50% of those around you are carrying, concealed or open. Hmmm... funny thing.. I just realized.... I hear a lot fewer news stories regarding armed robbery here in WY than I did when I lived in NY. Geee...... I wonder why?

    Because there are far fewer people?
    Because the average income has gone up quickly in WY over the last 10 years, and cost of living has stayed quite low?
    Because Wyoming has a very low poverty rate compared to NY? so people don't have to resort to extreme measures to try and feed themselves or their families?

    I'm not saying all armed robbery cases are due to poverty, but the statistics show that a disproportionately large number of people who commit these crimes are often in terrible financial situations.

    For what it's worth, in 2017 Wyoming had the 8th highest number of gun deaths per capita, while New York was 49th. Illinois was 30th. These numbers, of course, include suicide, which is why Hawaii probably has the lowest number of gun deaths, as apparently everyone there is happy as fuck.


    Correlation does not imply causation.

    DaiTengu

    ... Extinction is the ultimate fate of all species.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com
  • From Tracker1@TRN to Dumas Walker on Thursday, July 07, 2022 13:36:48
    On 6/24/22 14:10, Dumas Walker wrote:

    Exactly. I may not have worded it exactly right. I think they
    believe that law abiding citizens having guns means there are more
    guns out there for law breaking persons to have access to
    (whilebreaking the law). Their belief is that we should be willing
    to give up our guns, or at least have ours all registered, tracked,
    and restricted (as to what we can own) so that criminals cannot get
    their hands on them. <rollseyes>

    Realistically, if they *REALLY* wanted to cut down on gun violence,
    they'd be trying to outlaw handguns, not rifles (AR-15 etc) to begin
    with. The vast majority of gun violence and gun related crimes (armed robbery, etc) is done with a handgun... but those aren't the ones that typically make the headlines and are exceedingly rare.

    Note: this is not an endorsement of the idea, just pointing out the
    ignorance and hypocrisy.
    --
    Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com
    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Tracker1@TRN to Moondog on Thursday, July 07, 2022 13:40:58
    On 6/25/22 09:35, Moondog wrote:

    It can be a mixed bag. The other day someone was buying handguns for
    he and his wife. Hios wife works in a marijuana dispensary and
    handles large sums of cash, and was asking if open carry might be
    preferable over concealed carry, which would take longer to get a
    permit.

    I told them a visible firearm is like a flashlight in a dark room.
    You can see your enemies, but they can see you have a flashlight.
    While it should discourage bad actors, it also singles you out as the biggest threat to take out first. Concealed carry keeps everybody
    guessing. And polite.

    Unfortunately, as long as marijuana is federally illegal, any and all
    crimes that may occur at a dispensary would likely involve charges
    against anyone carrying firearms, including store personnel. Here in
    AZ, security is often outside the building, or in an entry area
    technically separate from the store area for this reason.

    Firearms + Scheduled drugs == increased federal penalties.
    --
    Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com
    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Tracker1 on Friday, July 08, 2022 20:53:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Tracker1 to Dumas Walker on Thu Jul 07 2022 01:36 pm

    On 6/24/22 14:10, Dumas Walker wrote:

    Exactly. I may not have worded it exactly right. I think they
    believe that law abiding citizens having guns means there are more
    guns out there for law breaking persons to have access to
    (whilebreaking the law). Their belief is that we should be willing
    to give up our guns, or at least have ours all registered, tracked,
    and restricted (as to what we can own) so that criminals cannot get
    their hands on them. <rollseyes>

    Realistically, if they *REALLY* wanted to cut down on gun violence,
    they'd be trying to outlaw handguns, not rifles (AR-15 etc) to begin
    with. The vast majority of gun violence and gun related crimes (armed robbery, etc) is done with a handgun... but those aren't the ones that typically make the headlines and are exceedingly rare.

    Note: this is not an endorsement of the idea, just pointing out the ignorance and hypocrisy.
    --
    Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com


    Even in the orgianl language of the NFA act of 1934, handguns were intended to
    be banned. The problem was even most folk who say they are anti-gun
    wouldn't mind owning a handgun to be kept by their bed. An analogy is razor blades are safer than axes even though it's easier to hide a razor blade and they can do their of damage if they slice a major artery.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Tracker1 on Friday, July 08, 2022 20:58:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Tracker1 to Moondog on Thu Jul 07 2022 01:40 pm

    On 6/25/22 09:35, Moondog wrote:

    It can be a mixed bag. The other day someone was buying handguns for
    he and his wife. Hios wife works in a marijuana dispensary and
    handles large sums of cash, and was asking if open carry might be preferable over concealed carry, which would take longer to get a
    permit.

    I told them a visible firearm is like a flashlight in a dark room.
    You can see your enemies, but they can see you have a flashlight.
    While it should discourage bad actors, it also singles you out as the biggest threat to take out first. Concealed carry keeps everybody guessing. And polite.

    Unfortunately, as long as marijuana is federally illegal, any and all
    crimes that may occur at a dispensary would likely involve charges
    against anyone carrying firearms, including store personnel. Here in
    AZ, security is often outside the building, or in an entry area
    technically separate from the store area for this reason.

    Firearms + Scheduled drugs == increased federal penalties.
    --
    Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com


    That may be the case in a civil suit, however there's little or no chances of
    a person comitting armed robbery on a dispensary being treated as a
    victim.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to TRACKER1 on Sunday, July 10, 2022 14:26:00
    Realistically, if they *REALLY* wanted to cut down on gun violence,
    they'd be trying to outlaw handguns, not rifles (AR-15 etc) to begin
    with. The vast majority of gun violence and gun related crimes (armed robbery, etc) is done with a handgun... but those aren't the ones that typically make the headlines and are exceedingly rare.

    Note: this is not an endorsement of the idea, just pointing out the
    ignorance and hypocrisy.

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a "mass
    shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed each day by handguns.


    * SLMR 2.1a * If all appears to go well, you missed something...

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Dumas Walker on Sunday, July 10, 2022 19:27:00
    Dumas Walker wrote to TRACKER1 <=-

    Realistically, if they *REALLY* wanted to cut down on gun violence,
    they'd be trying to outlaw handguns, not rifles (AR-15 etc) to begin
    with. The vast majority of gun violence and gun related crimes (armed robbery, etc) is done with a handgun... but those aren't the ones that typically make the headlines and are exceedingly rare.

    Note: this is not an endorsement of the idea, just pointing out the ignorance and hypocrisy.

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a
    "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed
    each day by handguns.

    Definitely true. Chicago probably tops that list. The city with the strictest gun laws anywhere. What they forget is that criminals don't
    obey laws.



    ... The world is full of surprises, very few of which are pleasant.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to GAMGEE on Monday, July 11, 2022 16:48:00
    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a
    "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed
    each day by handguns.

    Definitely true. Chicago probably tops that list. The city with the strictest gun laws anywhere. What they forget is that criminals don't
    obey laws.

    I really don't understand how someone like me can explain that to someone
    who seems to be able to follow logic and seems to be resonably intelligent,
    yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some of them just think that guns are scary and we are better off with less of them, but the "criminals don't
    obey laws" logic should be equally as scary.


    * SLMR 2.1a * Bureaucrats cut red tape--lengthwise.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Dumas Walker on Monday, July 11, 2022 21:47:00
    Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a
    "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed
    each day by handguns.

    Definitely true. Chicago probably tops that list. The city with the strictest gun laws anywhere. What they forget is that criminals don't
    obey laws.

    I really don't understand how someone like me can explain that to
    someone who seems to be able to follow logic and seems to be
    resonably intelligent, yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some
    of them just think that guns are scary and we are better off with
    less of them, but the "criminals don't obey laws" logic should be
    equally as scary.

    Yes, it should be just as scary. What I honestly think is that those
    who think more gun laws will fix the problem is that they actually are
    NOT interested in fixing the real problem. What they are interested
    in doing is increasing the amount of control that they can have over
    another group of people. It's really very petty and selfish, but that's
    the actual truth.

    The real problem is mental health, and the fact that so many are not
    able to get treatment for their issues.

    Gun contol laws are *PROVEN* to be ineffective, and the so called "red
    flag" laws that the same people want were *JUST* proven to be equally as useless, right there in Highland Park, Illinois. It was a textbook
    example case of complete failure.


    ... Vote Democrat. It's easier than thinking!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to GAMGEE on Tuesday, July 12, 2022 16:15:00
    resonably intelligent, yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some
    of them just think that guns are scary and we are better off with
    less of them, but the "criminals don't obey laws" logic should be equally as scary.

    Yes, it should be just as scary. What I honestly think is that those
    who think more gun laws will fix the problem is that they actually are
    NOT interested in fixing the real problem. What they are interested
    in doing is increasing the amount of control that they can have over
    another group of people. It's really very petty and selfish, but that's
    the actual truth.

    No doubt, that is certainly true of the politicians who claim that more
    laws will fix the problem. I was thinking more in terms of the voters.

    The real problem is mental health, and the fact that so many are not
    able to get treatment for their issues.

    Yes. I also think there is some disconnect going on with our society. It
    used to be, when asked in school what they want to be when they grow up, younger people would mention some profession. Supposedly, now they are
    more likely to want to "be famous." If a kid who wants to be famous is
    also one that does not see much hope in life, being famous by doing
    something stupid, whether it be drinking bleach on Tik-Tok or shooting up a school, somehow seems OK to them.

    Gun contol laws are *PROVEN* to be ineffective, and the so called "red
    flag" laws that the same people want were *JUST* proven to be equally as useless, right there in Highland Park, Illinois. It was a textbook
    example case of complete failure.

    There have been several shooters this year that "were on (some law
    enforcement agency's) radar" but yet were not seen as enough of a threat to
    do anything about until it was too late. A family member has an issue with
    a stalker. The stalker, after doing a drive-by at their house, apparently murdered someone in another part of town and got caught for that. The
    family member was worried about them being released on house arrest to
    await trial. I told them to phone in a tip and suggest the shooter was a member of the January 6 mob as that seems to be the only thing that these
    law enforcement groups care about. Otherwise, you are not enough of a
    threat.


    * SLMR 2.1a * Make headlines! Use a corduroy pillow.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Dumas Walker on Tuesday, July 12, 2022 20:17:00
    Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

    resonably intelligent, yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some
    of them just think that guns are scary and we are better off with
    less of them, but the "criminals don't obey laws" logic should be equally as scary.

    Yes, it should be just as scary. What I honestly think is that those
    who think more gun laws will fix the problem is that they actually are
    NOT interested in fixing the real problem. What they are interested
    in doing is increasing the amount of control that they can have over
    another group of people. It's really very petty and selfish, but that's
    the actual truth.

    No doubt, that is certainly true of the politicians who claim
    that more laws will fix the problem. I was thinking more in
    terms of the voters.

    Well, I think the voters who vote for such politicians are exactly the
    same. They see the passage of any "gun control" legislation as a
    "victory" for themselves, as in they feel like they have gained some
    control over their fellow citizens who don't feel the same way they do.

    The real problem is mental health, and the fact that so many are not
    able to get treatment for their issues.

    Yes. I also think there is some disconnect going on with our
    society. It used to be, when asked in school what they want to
    be when they grow up, younger people would mention some
    profession. Supposedly, now they are more likely to want to "be
    famous." If a kid who wants to be famous is also one that does
    not see much hope in life, being famous by doing something
    stupid, whether it be drinking bleach on Tik-Tok or shooting up a
    school, somehow seems OK to them.

    Wow, hadn't even considered that but it makes perfect sense now that you mention it. What a sad thing that is.

    Gun contol laws are *PROVEN* to be ineffective, and the so called "red
    flag" laws that the same people want were *JUST* proven to be equally as useless, right there in Highland Park, Illinois. It was a textbook
    example case of complete failure.

    There have been several shooters this year that "were on (some
    law enforcement agency's) radar" but yet were not seen as enough
    of a threat to do anything about until it was too late. A family
    member has an issue with a stalker. The stalker, after doing a
    drive-by at their house, apparently murdered someone in another
    part of town and got caught for that. The family member was
    worried about them being released on house arrest to await trial.
    I told them to phone in a tip and suggest the shooter was a
    member of the January 6 mob as that seems to be the only thing
    that these law enforcement groups care about. Otherwise, you are
    not enough of a threat.

    True enough. There are some (many) "mainstream media" outlets that have
    shown little else than that issue (Jan 6th) on their daily broadcasts recently. I mean like all day, with only brief intermissions for any
    other news they might think advances their agenda also. It has become
    so obvious that these organizations are no longer "news" agencies, but
    have become the public relations arm of the masters that they serve. Generally all of them are in the liberal/Democrat camp. Pathetic.



    ... Apathy Error: Strike any key...or none, for that matter.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Gamgee on Thursday, July 14, 2022 01:00:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Gamgee to Dumas Walker on Sun Jul 10 2022 07:27 pm

    Dumas Walker wrote to TRACKER1 <=-

    Realistically, if they *REALLY* wanted to cut down on gun violence, they'd be trying to outlaw handguns, not rifles (AR-15 etc) to begin with. The vast majority of gun violence and gun related crimes (armed robbery, etc) is done with a handgun... but those aren't the ones that typically make the headlines and are exceedingly rare.

    Note: this is not an endorsement of the idea, just pointing out the ignorance and hypocrisy.

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a
    "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed
    each day by handguns.

    Definitely true. Chicago probably tops that list. The city with the strictest gun laws anywhere. What they forget is that criminals don't
    obey laws.



    ... The world is full of surprises, very few of which are pleasant.

    Chicago blames northwest Indiana towns such as South Bend for the guns in chicago. Granted, South Bend has it's own troubles, however the streets do
    not flow with blood like Chicago's mayor would make you belive.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Gamgee on Thursday, July 14, 2022 01:04:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Gamgee to Dumas Walker on Mon Jul 11 2022 09:47 pm

    Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a
    "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed each day by handguns.

    Definitely true. Chicago probably tops that list. The city with the strictest gun laws anywhere. What they forget is that criminals don't obey laws.

    I really don't understand how someone like me can explain that to someone who seems to be able to follow logic and seems to be
    resonably intelligent, yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some
    of them just think that guns are scary and we are better off with
    less of them, but the "criminals don't obey laws" logic should be equally as scary.

    Yes, it should be just as scary. What I honestly think is that those
    who think more gun laws will fix the problem is that they actually are
    NOT interested in fixing the real problem. What they are interested
    in doing is increasing the amount of control that they can have over
    another group of people. It's really very petty and selfish, but that's
    the actual truth.

    The real problem is mental health, and the fact that so many are not
    able to get treatment for their issues.

    Gun contol laws are *PROVEN* to be ineffective, and the so called "red
    flag" laws that the same people want were *JUST* proven to be equally as useless, right there in Highland Park, Illinois. It was a textbook
    example case of complete failure.


    ... Vote Democrat. It's easier than thinking!

    It goes well beyond mental health. Crazy people are a minority of
    shooters when compared to organized crime and gang murders. What happened to the beliefs that life has value?

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Moondog on Thursday, July 14, 2022 07:34:00
    Moondog wrote to Gamgee <=-

    The real problem is mental health, and the fact that so many are not
    able to get treatment for their issues.

    Gun contol laws are *PROVEN* to be ineffective, and the so called "red
    flag" laws that the same people want were *JUST* proven to be equally as useless, right there in Highland Park, Illinois. It was a textbook
    example case of complete failure.

    It goes well beyond mental health. Crazy people are a minority
    of shooters when compared to organized crime and gang murders.

    No argument there. I may have been thinking more along the lines of
    "school shooters" when I said that. In that sub-category, I think the
    crazies dominate.

    What happened to the beliefs that life has value?

    I wish I knew. Certainly seem to have gone missing.


    ... It's a chain saw. I always carry one for emergencies.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to MOONDOG on Thursday, July 14, 2022 16:13:00
    Chicago blames northwest Indiana towns such as South Bend for the guns in chicago. Granted, South Bend has it's own troubles, however the streets do not flow with blood like Chicago's mayor would make you belive.

    During a trip through NW Indiana last fall, I saw a whole bunch of
    fireworks stores. I only saw one or two gun stores. This was on US 41 and
    US 12, just outside of Chicago and beyond to Michigan City.


    * SLMR 2.1a * "End of quote. Repeat the line." - Biden Words of Wisdom

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to GAMGEE on Thursday, July 14, 2022 16:14:00
    It goes well beyond mental health. Crazy people are a minority
    of shooters when compared to organized crime and gang murders.

    No argument there. I may have been thinking more along the lines of
    "school shooters" when I said that. In that sub-category, I think the crazies dominate.

    Until the urge to become famous because so prevalent, I think a lot of
    these mass shooter kids would have been the ones that committed suicide
    when I was high school aged. Now they shoot a bunch of other people first.


    * SLMR 2.1a * "End of quote. Repeat the line." - Biden Words of Wisdom

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Arelor@PALANT to Dumas Walker on Thursday, July 14, 2022 18:38:17
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to GAMGEE on Thu Jul 14 2022 04:14 pm

    No argument there. I may have been thinking more along the lines of "school shooters" when I said that. In that sub-category, I think the crazies dominate.

    Until the urge to become famous because so prevalent, I think a lot of
    these mass shooter kids would have been the ones that committed suicide
    when I was high school aged. Now they shoot a bunch of other people first.


    If I found my school was ruining my life to the point I wanted to die, then setting the school on fire with everybody who I thought was ruining my life inside would look reasonable. Perpretators of school massacres have this tendency to kill themselves as a final act of victory too: they kill themselves
    so society is deprived of the delight of keeping on hurting them.

    The fact there is so much school violence should point out the fact that schools are structured as stressful places in which people is broken past the point of no return. I never see anybody talking about this.

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Dumas Walker on Thursday, July 14, 2022 20:19:00
    Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

    It goes well beyond mental health. Crazy people are a minority
    of shooters when compared to organized crime and gang murders.

    No argument there. I may have been thinking more along the lines of
    "school shooters" when I said that. In that sub-category, I think the crazies dominate.

    Until the urge to become famous because so prevalent, I think a
    lot of these mass shooter kids would have been the ones that
    committed suicide when I was high school aged. Now they shoot a
    bunch of other people first.

    Yup. :-(



    ... The future's uncertain, the end is always near.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Friday, July 15, 2022 02:41:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to MOONDOG on Thu Jul 14 2022 04:13 pm

    Chicago blames northwest Indiana towns such as South Bend for the guns in chicago. Granted, South Bend has it's own troubles, however the streets d not flow with blood like Chicago's mayor would make you belive.

    During a trip through NW Indiana last fall, I saw a whole bunch of
    fireworks stores. I only saw one or two gun stores. This was on US 41 and US 12, just outside of Chicago and beyond to Michigan City.


    * SLMR 2.1a * "End of quote. Repeat the line." - Biden Words of Wisdom

    I used to shop at Kempf's in Micigan City. Then there's Cabela's in Hammond.
    I recall there was some dude in Michigan City had a milsurp/ prepper/ gun
    shop for awhile, then he lost his FFL. He still sold tactical gear, preps
    and AR parts, but no lower recievers.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Arelor on Friday, July 15, 2022 02:59:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Arelor to Dumas Walker on Thu Jul 14 2022 06:38 pm

    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to GAMGEE on Thu Jul 14 2022 04:14 pm

    No argument there. I may have been thinking more along the lines of "school shooters" when I said that. In that sub-category, I think the crazies dominate.

    Until the urge to become famous because so prevalent, I think a lot of these mass shooter kids would have been the ones that committed suicide when I was high school aged. Now they shoot a bunch of other people firs


    If I found my school was ruining my life to the point I wanted to die, then setting the school on fire with everybody who I thought was ruining my life inside would look reasonable. Perpretators of school massacres have this tendency to kill themselves as a final act of victory too: they kill themsel
    so society is deprived of the delight of keeping on hurting them.

    The fact there is so much school violence should point out the fact that schools are structured as stressful places in which people is broken past th point of no return. I never see anybody talking about this.

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    I was a misfit in school, and had my share of friends I thought were my friends. I had real friends as well, but very few. I was smart, but didn't fall in with the popular cliques, and found myself the target of being
    bullied and picked on by older kids. Nice thing about the few friends I had was they had me covered. Instead of being singled out in a hallway, a jerk wouldn't bother me if there was someone else with me.

    While I hated being treated like crap by bullies, I never had thoughts of killing anyone. Coming back later in life and making them miserable sounded more fun. For a millisecond I entertained the thought of burning down the school. I never would do such a thing, but I realized if i burned it down, another school would be built or the cliques and other BS in schools would be relocated elsewhere.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Gamgee on Friday, July 15, 2022 14:22:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Gamgee to Dumas Walker on Thu Jul 14 2022 08:19 pm

    Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

    It goes well beyond mental health. Crazy people are a minority
    of shooters when compared to organized crime and gang murders.

    No argument there. I may have been thinking more along the lines of "school shooters" when I said that. In that sub-category, I think the crazies dominate.

    Until the urge to become famous because so prevalent, I think a
    lot of these mass shooter kids would have been the ones that
    committed suicide when I was high school aged. Now they shoot a
    bunch of other people first.

    Yup. :-(



    ... The future's uncertain, the end is always near.

    I get the impression that comitting suicide in this case would not
    necessarily be about ending it all, but more for the attention factor. When the person ends it all, they're hoping for the people that didin't notice
    them to suddenly wish they knew them, or think they could have stopped this
    is they had only reached out. Some of that remorse will happen, then soon disappear. Other kids will fall under the radar and no one will make a
    change.

    Going out in a blaze of "glory" garners way more attention. Leave behind a note or a manifesto, and it will be on the news regardless how poorly written or illogical it is.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to ARELOR on Friday, July 15, 2022 15:06:00
    If I found my school was ruining my life to the point I wanted to die, then setting the school on fire with everybody who I thought was ruining my life inside would look reasonable. Perpretators of school massacres have this tendency to kill themselves as a final act of victory too: they kill themselve
    so society is deprived of the delight of keeping on hurting them.

    The fact there is so much school violence should point out the fact that schools are structured as stressful places in which people is broken past the point of no return. I never see anybody talking about this.

    In the case of the Uvalde school shooter, and some others also, they are
    not students at the school they shoot up. The Uvalde shooter picked a
    school with kids several years younger than he in attendance. I am not
    even sure he was still in school but, if he was, it would have been a high school where kids close to his age attended.


    * SLMR 2.1a * Tell me, is something eluding you, Sunshine?

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Saturday, July 16, 2022 01:09:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to ARELOR on Fri Jul 15 2022 03:06 pm

    If I found my school was ruining my life to the point I wanted to die, the setting the school on fire with everybody who I thought was ruining my lif inside would look reasonable. Perpretators of school massacres have this tendency to kill themselves as a final act of victory too: they kill thems
    so society is deprived of the delight of keeping on hurting them.

    The fact there is so much school violence should point out the fact that schools are structured as stressful places in which people is broken past point of no return. I never see anybody talking about this.

    In the case of the Uvalde school shooter, and some others also, they are
    not students at the school they shoot up. The Uvalde shooter picked a school with kids several years younger than he in attendance. I am not
    even sure he was still in school but, if he was, it would have been a high school where kids close to his age attended.


    * SLMR 2.1a * Tell me, is something eluding you, Sunshine?

    He was in high school. From what I read, he was an outcast with a learning di sability and was picked on and had no friends. He had a frined he used to
    hang out with until the kid's family moved away. He was in his senior year, and the school would place pictures of the seniors on the light poles in
    town. Somehow his picture was left out. He received teasing about that as well. Sounds liek the kid had a shitty time in school, but that only
    explains why he might have snapped, but doesn't excuse it. he proabably
    picked the elementary school because it was an easy target.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to Dumas Walker on Saturday, July 16, 2022 01:53:00
    Dumas Walker wrote to TRACKER1 <=-

    @MSGID: <62CB22A4.2278.dove-gun@capitolcityonline.net>
    @REPLY: <62C743E1.722.dove-firearms@roughneckbbs.com>
    @TZ: c12c
    Realistically, if they *REALLY* wanted to cut down on gun violence,
    they'd be trying to outlaw handguns, not rifles (AR-15 etc) to begin
    with. The vast majority of gun violence and gun related crimes (armed robbery, etc) is done with a handgun... but those aren't the ones that typically make the headlines and are exceedingly rare.

    Note: this is not an endorsement of the idea, just pointing out the ignorance and hypocrisy.

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed each day by handguns.

    Suffice it to say more people are killed by handguns each year than by rifles of any time.

    Suicides account for more firearms related deaths each year than any other. Rifles of any type are seldom utilized in suicide attempts.

    The problem is not the gun. The problem is the cheapening of human life. The cheapening of human life is a direct reflection of the society in which we live.

    Regards....

    ... The best way to accelerate a Mac is at 9.8m/s^2
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to Dumas Walker on Saturday, July 16, 2022 02:00:00
    Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a
    "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed
    each day by handguns.

    Definitely true. Chicago probably tops that list. The city with the strictest gun laws anywhere. What they forget is that criminals don't
    obey laws.

    I really don't understand how someone like me can explain that to
    someone who seems to be able to follow logic and seems to be resonably intelligent, yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some of them just
    think that guns are scary and we are better off with less of them, but
    the "criminals don't obey laws" logic should be equally as scary.

    The plain and simple truth of the matter is this. Firearms (of ANY type) are inert, inanimate objects. In and of themselves, they are incapable of any actions including actions of criminal and violent intent.

    Placed in the hands of an evil and malevolent individual, guns are capable of being used to commit acts of violence. Then again, placed in the hands of a malevolent individual, fertilizer and kerosene can be used to commit acts of violence. Placed in the hands of a malevolent individual, castor beans can be used to commit acts of violence. Placed in the hands of a malevolent individual a motor vehicle has proven to be able to be used in lethal acts of violence.

    The common thread? The malevolent individual. Perhaps we should concentrate more on the acts and the intent more than the tools that are used...

    Regards...


    ... Wherever you go, there you are!
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Weatherman@TLCBBS to Gamgee on Saturday, July 16, 2022 02:04:00
    Gamgee wrote to Dumas Walker <=-



    I really don't understand how someone like me can explain that to
    someone who seems to be able to follow logic and seems to be
    resonably intelligent, yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some
    of them just think that guns are scary and we are better off with
    less of them, but the "criminals don't obey laws" logic should be
    equally as scary.

    Yes, it should be just as scary. What I honestly think is that those
    who think more gun laws will fix the problem is that they actually are
    NOT interested in fixing the real problem. What they are interested
    in doing is increasing the amount of control that they can have over another group of people. It's really very petty and selfish, but
    that's the actual truth.

    Those who the true power behind the push for gun control laws desire one outcome. They are seeking to disarm the American populace so that they may increase their power and influence over the general population. The Second Amendment is the protector of the entire Bill of Rights. Those who would impose severe gun restrictions upon us are the ones who desire to impose further limits upon our constitutional rights.

    Regards....


    ... What is mind? No matter! What is matter? Never mind! - Homer S.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to MOONDOG on Saturday, July 16, 2022 09:53:00
    He was in high school. From what I read, he was an outcast with a learning di
    sability and was picked on and had no friends. He had a frined he used to hang out with until the kid's family moved away. He was in his senior year, and the school would place pictures of the seniors on the light poles in town. Somehow his picture was left out. He received teasing about that as well. Sounds liek the kid had a shitty time in school, but that only explains why he might have snapped, but doesn't excuse it. he proabably picked the elementary school because it was an easy target.

    You are right, it does not excuse it. However, if I was one of those kids
    that picked on him, I would be rethinking my ways right about now.

    As you point out in another message, even if some of the kids do rethink
    their ways, it probably won't have a lasting affect. :(


    * SLMR 2.1a * "End of quote. Repeat the line." - Biden Words of Wisdom

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Arelor@PALANT to Dumas Walker on Saturday, July 16, 2022 12:39:34
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to MOONDOG on Sat Jul 16 2022 09:53 am

    He was in high school. From what I read, he was an outcast with a learning di
    sability and was picked on and had no friends. He had a frined he used to hang out with until the kid's family moved away. He was in his senior year,
    and the school would place pictures of the seniors on the light poles in town. Somehow his picture was left out. He received teasing about that as
    well. Sounds liek the kid had a shitty time in school, but that only explains why he might have snapped, but doesn't excuse it. he proabably picked the elementary school because it was an easy target.

    You are right, it does not excuse it. However, if I was one of those kids that picked on him, I would be rethinking my ways right about now.

    As you point out in another message, even if some of the kids do rethink their ways, it probably won't have a lasting affect. :(


    * SLMR 2.1a * "End of quote. Repeat the line." - Biden Words of Wisdom

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP

    The problem with bullying is that it is a tribalistic phenomena. People is known to
    reinforce their identity by attacking people who belongs outside to their own group.
    This is why if somebody at shcool sticks out as different from the rest, it will be
    targetted: the other students will feel a sense of belonging to the classroom by
    picking on a perceived outsider.

    This can also be seen in workplace abuse, in which people with work ethics different
    from the rest of the workers will be picked on. It is usually the peolpe with strong
    work ethics that gets targetted, specially if the rest of the group has poor work
    ethics.

    If the group has clear leaders (and there usually are), the fact one of the leaders
    decides to harass a given individual will be taken by the rest of the people as tacit
    permission to do the same. This is why if the cool kid in the class starts picking on
    somebody, the rest will soon follow.

    Why I am saying this? Because this dynamic makes bullies feel subconsciously justified
    in doing what they do. If they bully a little kid and his bigger brother shows up and
    breaks the bully's face, the bully will feel wronged because he will think the had the
    right to be an asshole. If you can find it, I recommend you to watch that documentary
    about Little Zangief and the aftermath - Little Zangief was a kid who was bullied in
    school, and one day he snaped and broke his bully's leg. When asked if he regreted
    being a bully, the bully said "No." Then he looked past the camera, as if watching
    somebody give him indications, and said "... I mean, yes."

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Weatherman on Saturday, July 16, 2022 15:30:00
    Weatherman wrote to Gamgee <=-

    I really don't understand how someone like me can explain that to
    someone who seems to be able to follow logic and seems to be
    resonably intelligent, yet they won't understand it. IMHO, some
    of them just think that guns are scary and we are better off with
    less of them, but the "criminals don't obey laws" logic should be
    equally as scary.

    Yes, it should be just as scary. What I honestly think is that those
    who think more gun laws will fix the problem is that they actually are
    NOT interested in fixing the real problem. What they are interested
    in doing is increasing the amount of control that they can have over another group of people. It's really very petty and selfish, but
    that's the actual truth.

    Those who the true power behind the push for gun control laws
    desire one outcome. They are seeking to disarm the American
    populace so that they may increase their power and influence over
    the general population. The Second Amendment is the protector of
    the entire Bill of Rights. Those who would impose severe gun
    restrictions upon us are the ones who desire to impose further
    limits upon our constitutional rights.

    Yes, full agreement on that. Many of them don't even bother to try and
    hide that fact as their ultimate goal any more.



    ... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Weatherman on Saturday, July 16, 2022 17:11:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Weatherman to Dumas Walker on Sat Jul 16 2022 01:53 am

    Dumas Walker wrote to TRACKER1 <=-

    @MSGID: <62CB22A4.2278.dove-gun@capitolcityonline.net>
    @REPLY: <62C743E1.722.dove-firearms@roughneckbbs.com>
    @TZ: c12c
    Realistically, if they *REALLY* wanted to cut down on gun violence, they'd be trying to outlaw handguns, not rifles (AR-15 etc) to begin with. The vast majority of gun violence and gun related crimes (armed robbery, etc) is done with a handgun... but those aren't the ones that typically make the headlines and are exceedingly rare.

    Note: this is not an endorsement of the idea, just pointing out the ignorance and hypocrisy.

    Yes, this is true. There are some cities that probably have a "mass shootings" worth of people, and then some, shot and killed each day by handguns.

    Suffice it to say more people are killed by handguns each year than by rifle of any time.

    Suicides account for more firearms related deaths each year than any other. Rifles of any type are seldom utilized in suicide attempts.

    The problem is not the gun. The problem is the cheapening of human life. T cheapening of human life is a direct reflection of the society in which we live.

    Regards....

    ... The best way to accelerate a Mac is at 9.8m/s^2

    Agreed. the best way to reduce gun violence is to go after the root of violence. If you take away the guns by themselves, the violent behavior wil continue.

    Handguns are interesting in that most folk are cool with them existing. I forgot which country it was, but the epople feared the militarisation of
    their police, so their police are prohibited from caryr rifles or submachine guns. Instead, their special response teams have pistols mounted in chassis similar to the CAA Roni that give them similar functionality to a rifle or
    sub gun.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Saturday, July 16, 2022 17:44:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to MOONDOG on Sat Jul 16 2022 09:53 am

    He was in high school. From what I read, he was an outcast with a learnin sability and was picked on and had no friends. He had a frined he used to hang out with until the kid's family moved away. He was in his senior yea and the school would place pictures of the seniors on the light poles in town. Somehow his picture was left out. He received teasing about that a well. Sounds liek the kid had a shitty time in school, but that only explains why he might have snapped, but doesn't excuse it. he proabably picked the elementary school because it was an easy target.

    You are right, it does not excuse it. However, if I was one of those kids that picked on him, I would be rethinking my ways right about now.

    As you point out in another message, even if some of the kids do rethink their ways, it probably won't have a lasting affect. :(


    * SLMR 2.1a * "End of quote. Repeat the line." - Biden Words of Wisdom

    Along the lines of empathy of students among their peers, I recall there was always someone who had a crush on someone popular, whether it was the
    quiet barely noticable guy in love with cheerleader, or a girl crazy about an athlete or other popular dude. The attraction would vary from a quiet observation to what i refer to as stalker crushes, where they either try to find ways of initiazting contact or even worse, write long crazy letters
    about how they were destined to be together. One summer I was hanging out
    with a friend who had transferred from another school system, and he had a friend with him. I had mentioned how early in the day I went to a family reunion, and they asked if ther were any of my cousins they might've know at the other school. One of my cousins was the head cheerleader/ homecoming
    queen type, and it turned out my buddy's friend had one of those stalker crushes which ended terribly because a letter he write wasn't taken kindly.

    His friend became withdrawn and wouldn't even look at me. I wanted to ask for more details, but my firend said it was better to let sleeping dogs lay. I
    get the impression the response was devastating, and the dude went into
    serious depression over the rejection. The due wasn't ugly or creepy at all.
    He and my cousin had nothing in common and rolled with different cliques thaot didn't interact.

    My sister had her share of creepy stalker dudes that would come by the house looking for her. Some were harmless, but others had a serial killer vibe
    going on. The easiest way to get them to leave was tell them she is at her friend's house - the friend whose father was a state trooper. I'm not sure
    of my sister would've felt any sadness if something bad happened to them back then. She is a different person now, and I think she likes the attention. i noticed after I joined Facebook, she began friending several of my friends
    she would've never given the time of day to. Several were brothers and
    sisters of existing friends.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to WEATHERMAN on Sunday, July 17, 2022 08:07:00
    The problem is not the gun. The problem is the cheapening of human life. The
    cheapening of human life is a direct reflection of the society in which we live.

    Agreed.


    * SLMR 2.1a * "Mmmmmmmm.....doughnuts."

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Sunday, July 17, 2022 22:48:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to WEATHERMAN on Sun Jul 17 2022 08:07 am

    The problem is not the gun. The problem is the cheapening of human life. cheapening of human life is a direct reflection of the society in which we live.

    Agreed.


    * SLMR 2.1a * "Mmmmmmmm.....doughnuts."


    Agreedx2.

    A few weeks ago on a Facebook thread I cited an article from about 10 years ag o a local 8 year old killed his 4 year old brother over the last bowl of cereal left in the box. A commenter said "boys will be boys," as if this was acceptable behavior. Not in my parent's house. Not in my neighborhood would something like that happen.


    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net
  • From Dumas Walker@CAPCITY2 to MOONDOG on Monday, July 18, 2022 15:56:00
    A few weeks ago on a Facebook thread I cited an article from about 10 years ag
    o a local 8 year old killed his 4 year old brother over the last bowl of cereal left in the box. A commenter said "boys will be boys," as if this was acceptable behavior. Not in my parent's house. Not in my neighborhood would something like that happen.

    That is a rather callous, desensitized reaction that commenter had, assuming
    it was not sarcasm. My parents would not have put up with violent,
    agressive behavior, either.


    * SLMR 2.1a * "My eyeballs nearly popped out!"

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Moondog@CAVEBBS to Dumas Walker on Tuesday, July 19, 2022 14:02:00
    Re: Re: Gun Insurance
    By: Dumas Walker to MOONDOG on Mon Jul 18 2022 03:56 pm

    A few weeks ago on a Facebook thread I cited an article from about 10 year o a local 8 year old killed his 4 year old brother over the last bowl of cereal left in the box. A commenter said "boys will be boys," as if this acceptable behavior. Not in my parent's house. Not in my neighborhood wo something like that happen.

    That is a rather callous, desensitized reaction that commenter had, assuming it was not sarcasm. My parents would not have put up with violent, agressive behavior, either.


    * SLMR 2.1a * "My eyeballs nearly popped out!"

    The commenter also tried to justify it by saying kids have so much violent energy that is suppressed, all young boys are time bombs. I think that was also directed by the race of the children, which was black. That's BS. Children may have a level of cruelty based on immaturity, but disregard for life like that has to be observed or taught. I have no idea if these kids
    come from a violent home or were abused, or if domestic abuse was present. That is not behavior anyone I ever grew up with ever displayed.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net