• sbbs as fidonet hub

    From Ragnarok@DOCKSUD to All on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 03:16:57
    Hello

    I would like to know if anyone has experience using sbbs as a fidonet hub. Being sbbs a node that distributes to other nodes
    Without external tools, using binkit.js, sbbsecho, tickit.js, etc.

    Currently I have a node and I distribute to points and this works more or less well
    But I am interested in knowing if this scenario is possible and functional

    Thanks
    Greetings!

    --
    Ragnarok

    Dock Sud BBS
    https://bbs.docksud.com.ar
    tw: @docksud
    fb: DockSudBBS

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Dock Sud BBS TLD 24 HS - bbs.docksud.com.ar
  • From Digital Man to Ragnarok on Monday, March 29, 2021 23:52:15
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Ragnarok to All on Tue Mar 30 2021 03:16 am

    Hello

    I would like to know if anyone has experience using sbbs as a fidonet hub. Being sbbs a node that distributes to other nodes
    Without external tools, using binkit.js, sbbsecho, tickit.js, etc.

    Currently I have a node and I distribute to points and this works more or less well
    But I am interested in knowing if this scenario is possible and functional

    Yes (of course).
    --
    digital man

    Rush quote #71:
    He's not concerned with yesterday, he knows constant change is here today Norco, CA WX: 55.1°F, 81.0% humidity, 0 mph SE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Rampage@SESTAR to Ragnarok on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 08:39:12
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Ragnarok to All on Tue Mar 30 2021 03:16:57


    I would like to know if anyone has experience using sbbs as a fidonet
    hub. Being sbbs a node that distributes to other nodes Without
    external tools, using binkit.js, sbbsecho, tickit.js, etc.

    sestar is one of the three top-tier backbone distribution systems in fidonet... it is also a FileGate FDN distribution HUB...

    when first set up, sestar used only sbbs tools... everything worked just fine... later on, sestar switched to using binkd for the mailer as an experiment and to also be able to work on what is needed for the sbbs package to do
    full 5D FTN addressing...

    some things are missing (eg: announcing newly arrived and processed files) but those are just icing on the cake and not really necessary...


    )\/(ark

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR
  • From Al@TRMB to Rampage on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 06:48:37
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Rampage to Ragnarok on Tue Mar 30 2021 08:39 am

    sestar is one of the three top-tier backbone distribution systems in fidonet... it is also a FileGate FDN distribution HUB...

    I find that SBBSecho is too agressive with dupes.

    What I mean is new messages like monthly rules postings or BBS ads are considered dupes even though they have a new MSGID and time stamp in the message header they are considered dupes and dropped.

    some things are missing (eg: announcing newly arrived and processed files) but those are just icing on the cake and not really necessary...

    Yes, I have found that too. I like the icing on my cake better than the cake itself and find it necessary. :)

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... For people who like peace & quiet - A phoneless cord!

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Rampage@SESTAR to Al on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 10:05:01
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Rampage on Tue Mar 30 2021 06:48:37


    sestar is one of the three top-tier backbone distribution systems
    in fidonet... it is also a FileGate FDN distribution HUB...

    I find that SBBSecho is too agressive with dupes.

    agreed... it could use with some options to select certain specific dupe detection algorithms...

    What I mean is new messages like monthly rules postings or BBS
    ads are considered dupes even though they have a new MSGID and
    time stamp in the message header they are considered dupes and
    dropped.

    exactly... this is because it checksums the message body and doesn't take the time stamps or MSGIDs into account...

    some things are missing (eg: announcing newly arrived and
    processed files) but those are just icing on the cake and not
    really necessary...

    Yes, I have found that too. I like the icing on my cake better
    than the cake itself and find it necessary. :)

    true but they don't affect the moving of files or messages...


    )\/(ark

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR
  • From Al@TRMB to Rampage on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 11:48:40
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Rampage to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 10:05 am

    What I mean is new messages like monthly rules postings or BBS
    ads are considered dupes even though they have a new MSGID and
    time stamp in the message header they are considered dupes and
    dropped.

    exactly... this is because it checksums the message body and doesn't take the time stamps or MSGIDs into account...

    Yes, and thinking about the dupes we talked about a short time ago in FIDOTEST SBBSecho did catch that dupe, so we don't want to loose that capability.

    Maybe it would be enough to check the MSGID and pass it if it is different?

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... This message uses 100% recycled electrons

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Digital Man to Al on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 12:43:50
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Rampage on Tue Mar 30 2021 06:48 am

    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Rampage to Ragnarok on Tue Mar 30 2021 08:39 am

    sestar is one of the three top-tier backbone distribution systems in fidonet... it is also a FileGate FDN distribution HUB...

    I find that SBBSecho is too agressive with dupes.

    What I mean is new messages like monthly rules postings or BBS ads are considered dupes even though they have a new MSGID and time stamp in the message header they are considered dupes and dropped.

    You can turn off duplicate message checking (per sub-board) if you want duplicate message bodies to be imported. Duplicate MSGID checking cannot be disabled.
    --
    digital man

    Sling Blade quote #16:
    Karl Childers (to Doyle, re: lawn mower blade): I aim to kill you with it. Mmm. Norco, CA WX: 75.6°F, 39.0% humidity, 0 mph WNW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Al@TRMB to Digital Man on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 13:36:54
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 12:43 pm

    What I mean is new messages like monthly rules postings or BBS ads are
    considered dupes even though they have a new MSGID and time stamp in
    the message header they are considered dupes and dropped.

    You can turn off duplicate message checking (per sub-board) if you want duplicate message bodies to be imported. Duplicate MSGID checking cannot be disabled.

    We don't want to disable duplicate message checking. These days I get two or more copies of most messages.

    Sometimes messages like BBS ads or rules posting are reposted after a period of time so they get a fresh date and MSGID but the message body hasn't changed.

    Without checking the header for a new message date or MSGID those messages are considered dupes and dropped.

    That may or may not be an issue on a BBS but it is an issue for message flow in FTN networks. On our own BBS we might have seen a message before but our links may not have. These messages will not be forwarded by SBBSecho until the past message clears from the dupe database.

    Maybe the MSGID could be checked in addition to the message body? That's more of a thought than a conclusion.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Digital Man to Al on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 15:36:22
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Digital Man on Tue Mar 30 2021 01:36 pm

    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 12:43 pm

    What I mean is new messages like monthly rules postings or BBS ads are
    considered dupes even though they have a new MSGID and time stamp in
    the message header they are considered dupes and dropped.

    You can turn off duplicate message checking (per sub-board) if you want duplicate message bodies to be imported. Duplicate MSGID checking cannot be disabled.

    We don't want to disable duplicate message checking. These days I get two or more copies of most messages.

    Sometimes messages like BBS ads or rules posting are reposted after a period of time so they get a fresh date and MSGID but the message body hasn't changed.

    Without checking the header for a new message date or MSGID those messages are considered dupes and dropped.

    Right. So disable the duplicate message checking. Duplicate MSGIDs will still be detected and dropped.

    That may or may not be an issue on a BBS but it is an issue for message flow in FTN networks. On our own BBS we might have seen a message before but our links may not have. These messages will not be forwarded by SBBSecho until the past message clears from the dupe database.

    So disable the message checking in SCFG.

    Maybe the MSGID could be checked in addition to the message body? That's more of a thought than a conclusion.

    It already is. The duplicate MSGID checking is a separate check that cannot be disabled.
    --
    digital man

    Synchronet/BBS Terminology Definition #9:
    BSO = Binkley Style Outbound
    Norco, CA WX: 80.6°F, 30.0% humidity, 7 mph ENE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Dream Master@CIAD to Al on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 17:25:14
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Rampage on Tue Mar 30 2021 11:48 am

    Yes, and thinking about the dupes we talked about a short time ago in FIDOTEST SBBSecho did catch that dupe, so we don't want to loose that capability.

    Maybe it would be enough to check the MSGID and pass it if it is different?

    My understanding is that SBBSECHO tosses the messages while it relies upon the message base handler to check for duplicate messages. The aggressive nature of the duplicate checker is based on your own personal selection (number of CRCs to maintain).

    Brian Klauss <-> Dream Master
    Caught in a Dream | caughtinadream.com a Synchronet BBS

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Caught in a Dream - caughtinadream.com
  • From Al@TRMB to Digital Man on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 21:16:28
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 03:36 pm

    Without checking the header for a new message date or MSGID those
    messages are considered dupes and dropped.

    Right. So disable the duplicate message checking. Duplicate MSGIDs will still be detected and dropped.

    I don't want to defeat duplicate checking. If I do disable duplicate message checking then I will have message checking based solely on MSGID?

    There are still messages traveling the net with no MSGID so the only checking possible in those cases is duplicate message checking.

    Maybe the MSGID could be checked in addition to the message body?
    That's more of a thought than a conclusion.

    It already is. The duplicate MSGID checking is a separate check that cannot be disabled.

    That's not my experience. Currently I am seeing rules posts that have identical message bodies with a different MSGID detected as dupes and dropped.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... What?! I'm missing Star Tre$#%$^ NO CARRIER

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Al@TRMB to Dream Master on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 21:18:52
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Dream Master to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 05:25 pm

    Maybe it would be enough to check the MSGID and pass it if it is
    different?

    My understanding is that SBBSECHO tosses the messages while it relies upon the message base handler to check for duplicate messages. The aggressive nature of the duplicate checker is based on your own personal selection (number of CRCs to maintain).

    Yes, I have never considered disabling dupelicate message checking and I don't think that is what I want but I am going to reconsider my options.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... God is dead -Neitzsche Neitzsche is dead -God

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Digital Man to Al on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 21:27:49
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Digital Man on Tue Mar 30 2021 09:16 pm

    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 03:36 pm

    Without checking the header for a new message date or MSGID those
    messages are considered dupes and dropped.

    Right. So disable the duplicate message checking. Duplicate MSGIDs will still be detected and dropped.

    I don't want to defeat duplicate checking. If I do disable duplicate message checking then I will have message checking based solely on MSGID?

    Correct.

    There are still messages traveling the net with no MSGID so the only checking possible in those cases is duplicate message checking.

    Correct.

    Maybe the MSGID could be checked in addition to the message body?
    That's more of a thought than a conclusion.

    It already is. The duplicate MSGID checking is a separate check that cannot be disabled.

    That's not my experience. Currently I am seeing rules posts that have identical message bodies with a different MSGID detected as dupes and dropped.

    Right. If you have duplicate message checking enabled, then any duplicate message body text is considered "dupe" and dropped. If you don't want that behavior, disable the duplicate message checking (and risk more dupes that have no/different MSGIDs).

    It sounds like you're suggesting that *both* the text and the MSGID should be compared and equal in order to be considered a duplicate - to which I would ask: why bother? if the MSGID is a duplicate, it's a duplicate. No need to compare the message body in that case. But 2 messages with different MSGIDs but the same body text is either a network screw-up or someone purposely or accidentally posting the same content repeatedly. There's really no way for software to tell the difference. But you can import and forward those messages if you prefer to, you have that option.
    --
    digital man

    This Is Spinal Tap quote #7:
    Nigel Tufnel: That's just nitpicking, isn't it?
    Norco, CA WX: 63.3°F, 62.0% humidity, 0 mph S wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Digital Man on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 07:59:00
    Digital Man wrote to Al <=-

    That's not my experience. Currently I am seeing rules posts that have identical message bodies with a different MSGID detected as dupes and dropped.

    Right. If you have duplicate message checking enabled, then any
    duplicate message body text is considered "dupe" and dropped. If
    you don't want that behavior, disable the duplicate message
    checking (and risk more dupes that have no/different MSGIDs).

    It sounds like you're suggesting that *both* the text and the
    MSGID should be compared and equal in order to be considered a
    duplicate - to which I would ask: why bother? if the MSGID is a
    duplicate, it's a duplicate. No need to compare the message body
    in that case. But 2 messages with different MSGIDs but the same
    body text is either a network screw-up or someone purposely or accidentally posting the same content repeatedly.

    What he's describing is what happens with automated BBS ads and/or echo
    rules postings (just two examples). Same body, different MSGID, and
    they won't get distributed into the echos because the hub will drop it
    as a dupe. Those aren't malicious/spam messages, but they get dropped.

    There's really
    no way for software to tell the difference. But you can import
    and forward those messages if you prefer to, you have that
    option.

    They realistically can't be forwarded, because the next system in the
    link (probably a hub) will drop it as a dupe.

    I *think* he's saying that if the MSGID's are different, the message
    should not be considered a dupe, even if the body is identical to a
    previous message. I agree with that thinking.


    ... A woman drove me to drink, and I never had the courtesy to thank her.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Al@TRMB to Digital Man on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 06:32:46
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 09:27 pm

    It sounds like you're suggesting that *both* the text and the MSGID should be compared and equal in order to be considered a duplicate -

    Yes, I think that would do what I am hoping to do.

    to which I would ask: why bother?

    These messages (rules posts or BBS ads) do have identical message bodies but they have been newly posted, these are new posts with a different MSGID. We still want to be vigilant about dupes, in fact today we must be vigilant about dupes.

    Stepping away from the BBS side of this and looking at it from a mail flow point of view.. when linked to someones node, linked nodes have a reasonable expectation that they will receive all new messages in a given area that have been posted, and also that messages that enter the flow from their node will also be sent along to connected nodes.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... Proofread carefully to see if you any words out

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Rampage@SESTAR to Al on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 10:16:52
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Digital Man on Wed Mar 31 2021 06:32:46

    These messages (rules posts or BBS ads) do have identical message
    bodies but they have been newly posted, these are new posts with a
    different MSGID.

    AND Time Stamp! you keep forgetting to mention that ;)


    )\/(ark

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR
  • From fusion@CFBBS to Gamgee on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 11:36:00
    On 31 Mar 2021, Gamgee said the following...

    What he's describing is what happens with automated BBS ads and/or echo rules postings (just two examples). Same body, different MSGID, and
    they won't get distributed into the echos because the hub will drop it
    as a dupe. Those aren't malicious/spam messages, but they get dropped.

    this, of course, nobody agrees on. i for one have removed just about every
    area with a non stop barage of rules postings.. which everyone ignores except the one stickler who wants to refer to them. usually the otherwise completely dead area will spring back to life the second you post though, because the
    one dude posting the rules non stop doesn't agree with you and he's the only other person there..

    tbh i hate automated posts in general. every ham radio area on every net i've been on is completely ruined with the same non stop messages you get in your local club's mailing lists. and when's the last time you met a ham that isn't on their local club's mailing list?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to fusion on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 13:33:00
    fusion wrote to Gamgee <=-

    On 31 Mar 2021, Gamgee said the following...

    What he's describing is what happens with automated BBS ads and/or echo rules postings (just two examples). Same body, different MSGID, and
    they won't get distributed into the echos because the hub will drop it
    as a dupe. Those aren't malicious/spam messages, but they get dropped.

    this, of course, nobody agrees on. i for one have removed just
    about every area with a non stop barage of rules postings.. which
    everyone ignores except the one stickler who wants to refer to
    them. usually the otherwise completely dead area will spring back
    to life the second you post though, because the one dude posting
    the rules non stop doesn't agree with you and he's the only other
    person there..

    From what I've seen, rules postings are pretty infrequent in any of the
    echos that I follow. Not a big deal to just skip over them. But if
    you're trying to advertise your BBS with a 2x/month post, and it gets
    eaten by the hub as a dupe, you're not really "getting out" your advertisement. Hence my position that the dupes should maybe only be
    filtered out based on MSGID.

    tbh i hate automated posts in general. every ham radio area on
    every net i've been on is completely ruined with the same non
    stop messages you get in your local club's mailing lists. and
    when's the last time you met a ham that isn't on their local
    club's mailing list?

    I don't do ham radio, so can't comment on that.

    Looks like your <SHIFT> key is broken, BTW. Do you actually prefer to
    not use proper capitalization?



    ... Pros are those who do their jobs well, even when they don't feel like it. --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From fusion@CFBBS to Gamgee on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 17:56:00
    On 31 Mar 2021, Gamgee said the following...

    Looks like your <SHIFT> key is broken, BTW. Do you actually prefer to not use proper capitalization?

    ya

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi
  • From Digital Man to Gamgee on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 16:10:17
    Re: Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Gamgee to Digital Man on Wed Mar 31 2021 07:59 am

    It sounds like you're suggesting that *both* the text and the
    MSGID should be compared and equal in order to be considered a duplicate - to which I would ask: why bother? if the MSGID is a duplicate, it's a duplicate. No need to compare the message body
    in that case. But 2 messages with different MSGIDs but the same
    body text is either a network screw-up or someone purposely or accidentally posting the same content repeatedly.

    What he's describing is what happens with automated BBS ads and/or echo rules postings (just two examples). Same body, different MSGID, and
    they won't get distributed into the echos because the hub will drop it
    as a dupe. Those aren't malicious/spam messages, but they get dropped.

    There's no way for software to tell the difference between accidental and intentional repeated message body text.

    There's really
    no way for software to tell the difference. But you can import
    and forward those messages if you prefer to, you have that
    option.

    They realistically can't be forwarded, because the next system in the
    link (probably a hub) will drop it as a dupe.

    I *think* he's saying that if the MSGID's are different, the message
    should not be considered a dupe, even if the body is identical to a
    previous message. I agree with that thinking.

    Disable duplicate message checking and you will have that behavior.
    --
    digital man

    Synchronet "Real Fact" #124:
    The Loons - "Ten Inch Men" with Rob on drums: https://youtu.be/EBSlpojM4j0 Norco, CA WX: 85.2°F, 7.0% humidity, 3 mph WSW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Digital Man to Al on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 16:22:13
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Digital Man on Wed Mar 31 2021 06:32 am

    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Tue Mar 30 2021 09:27 pm

    It sounds like you're suggesting that *both* the text and the MSGID should be compared and equal in order to be considered a duplicate -

    Yes, I think that would do what I am hoping to do.

    If the MSGID is duplicate, there's no point in comparing the message body text. You already know it's a dupe.

    to which I would ask: why bother?

    These messages (rules posts or BBS ads) do have identical message bodies but they have been newly posted, these are new posts with a different MSGID. We still want to be vigilant about dupes, in fact today we must be vigilant about dupes.

    I'm not clear what your definitino of "vigilant about dupes" means. If you only care about duplicate MSGIDs, then disable the duplicate message checking and that is what you will get - but *I* don't consider that configuration to be vigilant.

    Stepping away from the BBS side of this and looking at it from a mail flow point of view.. when linked to someones node, linked nodes have a reasonable expectation that they will receive all new messages in a given area that have been posted, and also that messages that enter the flow from their node will also be sent along to connected nodes.

    I hope that my uplink will deduplicate messages using effective measures. If he doesn't, then I will. Duplicates should be detected and removed as upstream as possible, in my opinion. But if you want different behavior on your system, you have that option.

    I feel like we're talking past each other and I'm not really sure how else to state it: if you want to allow multiple messages to be imported into your message bases and passed to downlinks with the identical message body text of a previously imported message, then disable the duplicate message checking in SCFG. This will have no impact on duplicate MSGID checking. There is no configuration setting to disable dulpicate MSGID checking.
    --
    digital man

    Synchronet "Real Fact" #114:
    Weedpuller "Geographic" http://youtu.be/cpzBDVgmWSA
    Norco, CA WX: 84.8°F, 7.0% humidity, 0 mph WSW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Digital Man to Gamgee on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 16:30:40
    Re: Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Gamgee to fusion on Wed Mar 31 2021 01:33 pm

    Hence my position that the dupes should maybe only be
    filtered out based on MSGID.

    And you have that option.
    --
    digital man

    Synchronet "Real Fact" #75:
    Rob's alias "digital man" was inspired by a song on Rush's 1982 "Signals" album Norco, CA WX: 84.8°F, 7.0% humidity, 0 mph WSW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12 to Digital Man on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 20:05:49
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Wed Mar 31 2021 16:22:13


    If the MSGID is duplicate, there's no point in comparing the message body text. You already know it's a dupe.

    not always true... just ask daryl stout of thunderbolt bbs about the times i reported to him about his messages being detected as dupes because the sofware he was using at the time was creating basically random MSGIDs and some
    were duplicates of others only a few months old... in some cases, it may have been attributed to reinstallations and/or the loss of a/the msgid file if there was such in use... in any case, i know that he can tell about the
    problem... one of those packages was virtual advanced IIRC... there was another one or two that he tried before setteling on synchronet...

    i will admit that on systems with low retention of messages (and msgids), they might not see this but when one can (finally) retain enough to be able to check back over a 3 year period (FTN MSGIDs are not supposed to repeat
    within three years), it certainly pops up... when one also has a dupe message base the dupe messages can be tossed into, it is also easy enough to find the messages and compare them manually...


    )\/(ark
    --- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
    * Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)
  • From Digital Man to mark lewis on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 17:48:52
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: mark lewis to Digital Man on Wed Mar 31 2021 08:05 pm

    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Wed Mar 31 2021 16:22:13


    If the MSGID is duplicate, there's no point in comparing the message body text. You already know it's a dupe.

    not always true...

    For the purposes of Synchronet/SBBSecho, it's a duplicate and will not be imported. There is no provision in the Synchronet message bases for multiple MSGIDs of the same value.
    --
    digital man

    Rush quote #61:
    He's a rebel and a runner, he's a signal turning green .. New World Man
    Norco, CA WX: 83.6°F, 8.0% humidity, 0 mph S wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Digital Man on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 21:39:00
    Digital Man wrote to Gamgee <=-

    There's really
    no way for software to tell the difference. But you can import
    and forward those messages if you prefer to, you have that
    option.

    They realistically can't be forwarded, because the next system in the
    link (probably a hub) will drop it as a dupe.

    I *think* he's saying that if the MSGID's are different, the message
    should not be considered a dupe, even if the body is identical to a
    previous message. I agree with that thinking.

    Disable duplicate message checking and you will have that
    behavior.

    Yes, I understand that. But the bigger issue is that that will only
    allow the (seemingly) dupe message to appear on *MY* board. When we're talking about BBS ads, and echo rules postings, if those messages get
    dropped by the hub of the originating system, then *NOBODY* else is
    going to see it. The reality of it is that nearly every system (I
    think) has CRC dupe checking enabled, and therein lies the problem.

    I do see the alternative side, which is that a spammer could post a
    bunch of copies of some garbage, and since they all would have a
    different MSGID, they'd go through. It's a conundrum.

    Personally the way I've resolved it for my own system's semi-monthly BBS
    ad posting, is that I have a script that inserts the current date at the
    end of the boilerplate advertisement text, thereby making it a different
    CRC than the previous posting.



    ... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to Digital Man on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 21:41:00
    Digital Man wrote to Gamgee <=-

    Hence my position that the dupes should maybe only be
    filtered out based on MSGID.

    And you have that option.

    Yes, understood. I expanded my thoughts in a previous post a minute
    ago. It's all good, thank you DM, as always.




    ... Backup not found: (A)bort (R)etry (P)anic
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Gamgee@PALANT to fusion on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 21:42:00
    fusion wrote to Gamgee <=-

    Looks like your <SHIFT> key is broken, BTW. Do you actually prefer to
    not use proper capitalization?

    ya

    Why?



    ... He does the work of 3 Men...Moe, Larry & Curly
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Al@TRMB to Digital Man on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 22:53:47
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to Al on Wed Mar 31 2021 04:22 pm

    Yes, I think that would do what I am hoping to do.

    If the MSGID is duplicate, there's no point in comparing the message body text. You already know it's a dupe.

    I don't think that is so but I am not sure either.

    I'm not clear what your definitino of "vigilant about dupes" means. If you only care about duplicate MSGIDs, then disable the duplicate message checking and that is what you will get - but *I* don't consider that configuration to be vigilant.

    I mean that we need to be vigilant and stop dupes where they are. We also need to pass new traffic as it arrives just as diligently.

    This is more important for those nodes who pass traffic. Nodes that don't do that may feel that those dupes can simply go to dupe heaven.

    I hope that my uplink will deduplicate messages using effective measures. If he doesn't, then I will. Duplicates should be detected and removed as upstream as possible, in my opinion.

    I do too, and I hope that I will receive new traffic.

    But if you want different behavior on your system, you have that option.

    I could be wrong and I haven't tried it but I don't think detecting dupes by MSGID alone is a good option. Detecting dupes by message body CRC alone is not a good option either.

    I feel like we're talking past each other and I'm not really sure how else to state it: if you want to allow multiple messages to be imported into your message bases and passed to downlinks with the identical message body text of a previously imported message, then disable the duplicate message checking in SCFG. This will have no impact on duplicate MSGID checking. There is no configuration setting to disable dulpicate MSGID checking.

    I feel you, and I do understand your position.

    Some would say if it looks like a duck, and if it walks like a duck, and if it quacks like a duck, it's a duck.

    But I am saying that ain't no duck, in this case.

    I suppose it comes down to just what is a dupe. Is it a dupe if the msg body CRC is identical to a past post? That's a pretty good indication but I am suggesting we campare the MSGID of the two messages before we call it a dupe.

    Currently SBBSecho is dropping new messages from the flow of traffic because it has incorrectly trapped them as dupes when they are in fact new posts.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... Dew knot trussed yore spell chequer two fined awl mistakes!

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Digital Man to Al on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 23:14:05
    Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Al to Digital Man on Wed Mar 31 2021 10:53 pm

    I suppose it comes down to just what is a dupe. Is it a dupe if the msg body CRC is identical to a past post? That's a pretty good indication but I am suggesting we campare the MSGID of the two messages before we call it a dupe.

    If the MSGID is the same as a previously imported message, you don't need to compare the message body too. Re-scanned or otherwise accidentally reposted duplicate messages sometimes have modified body text (e.g. modified or additional tear/tag/origin lines) - but they're still dupes.

    Currently SBBSecho is dropping new messages from the flow of traffic because it has incorrectly trapped them as dupes when they are in fact new posts.

    So disable the duplicate message checking. I'm pretty sure I've said that already. :-)
    --
    digital man

    This Is Spinal Tap quote #16:
    David St. Hubbins: I believe virtually everything I read...
    Norco, CA WX: 68.6°F, 13.0% humidity, 1 mph SW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From Daryl Stout@TBOLT to mark lewis on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 22:57:00
    Mark,

    not always true... just ask daryl stout of thunderbolt bbs about the
    times i reported to him about his messages being detected as dupes

    That was when I was running Virtual Advanced (VADV32). The current
    author, Steve Winn, awhile back, said he'd have to completely redo the
    FIDONet tosser, but apparently he didn't have either the source code
    or full rights from the original author, Roland DeGraff (who had to
    stop developing it due to health issues).

    I've been running Synchronet for quite awhile now, and the main echoes
    I have dupes turned on in are the ones for ads (BBS, Network, Echo, etc.).
    Some systems post ads for their system several times a day...which to me,
    is overkill. I have the age in those echoes set to 30 days...but in the
    other echoes, it's 180 days (I don't consider messages timely more than
    6 months old). Besides, you have no idea if the original poster is still
    around or not.

    Daryl

    ... Change is inevitable, except from vending machines.
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Thunderbolt BBS - tbolt.synchro.net
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to mark lewis on Thursday, April 01, 2021 11:37:14
    Hi mark,

    On 2021-03-31 20:05:49, you wrote to Digital Man:

    If the MSGID is duplicate, there's no point in comparing the message
    body text. You already know it's a dupe.

    not always true... just ask daryl stout of thunderbolt bbs about the times i reported to him about his messages being detected as dupes because the sofware he was using at the time was creating basically random MSGIDs and some were duplicates of others only a few months old... in some cases, it may have been attributed to reinstallations and/or the loss of a/the msgid file if there was such in use... in any case, i know that he can tell about
    the problem... one of those packages was virtual advanced IIRC... there was
    another one or two that he tried before setteling on synchronet...

    I've seen them too in the past, when I was investigating cases of false dupe detection.

    I don't know how often it happens, because most probably go undetected. I'm not reading my dupe area on a regular basis, let alone scan it for false dupes... ;)

    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12 to Wilfred van Velzen on Thursday, April 01, 2021 08:33:26
    Re: Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Wilfred van Velzen to mark lewis on Thu Apr 01 2021 11:37:14


    I don't know how often it happens, because most probably go
    undetected. I'm not reading my dupe area on a regular basis,
    let alone scan it for false dupes... ;)

    when i was more active about it, i would look at my logs and see X messages detected as dupes via MSGID... so i would pop over to my dupe area in TimED or (later on) GoldEd and then just search for a MSGID from the list... in
    some cases, there would be one other match... in others there may be two or three...

    in any case, dupe checking in FTN is not done my /just/ detecting duplicate MSGIDs and rejecting the others... the header, including the time stamp, as well as the message body should be taken into account... it should also be
    said that CRC16/CRC32 on the message bodies is also not sifficient... even with filtering out white space and the various EoLs... this because, and most programmers know this, there's a limited supply of CRC values in the
    tables and it is all too easy to find "hash clashes"... CRC16 has only 65536 values... CRC32 has only 4294967296 values... the "Birthday Problem" also comes into play...

    these days, MD5 and SHA1 are also out due to defects in them... SHA256 would be the first really useful algorithm or SHA512... but the real key is to filter out the stuff that can change and hash only that which won't...

    anyway, i'm done with this topic in this area... the discussion really belongs elsewhere for those that are truely interested in implementing proper duplicate detection in FTNs...


    )\/(ark
    --- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
    * Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)
  • From Wilfred van Velzen@2:280/464 to mark lewis on Thursday, April 01, 2021 15:08:42
    * Originally in SYNCHRONET
    * Crossposted in NET_DEV

    Hi mark,

    On 2021-04-01 08:33:26, you wrote to me:

    in any case, dupe checking in FTN is not done my /just/ detecting duplicate MSGIDs and rejecting the others... the header, including the time stamp, as well as the message body should be taken into
    account...

    That's how FMail does it.

    it should also be said that CRC16/CRC32 on the message bodies is also
    not sifficient... even with filtering out white space and the various EoLs... this because, and most programmers know this, there's a
    limited supply of CRC values in the tables and it is all too easy to
    find "hash clashes"... CRC16 has only 65536 values... CRC32 has only 4294967296 values... the "Birthday Problem" also comes into play...

    Indeed. That's why it's on my todo list to go from 32 bit to 64 bit hash values in FMail. That would be more than enough to keep a (very) big dupe "database", and still have a very small probability for hash collisions.

    these days, MD5 and SHA1 are also out due to defects in them...

    That's because of their security aspect. That's not an issue when you would be using them as hash's for dupe detection.

    SHA256 would be the first really useful algorithm or SHA512...

    Using a 256 or even 512 bit secure hash value would be overkill for dupe detection. And would be using way too much resources to calculate and check them.

    64 Bit is enough, and it doesn't have to be secure. My prime candidate for FMail is this one:

    https://github.com/Cyan4973/xxHash

    but the real key is to filter out the stuff that can change and hash
    only that which won't...

    Indeed.

    anyway, i'm done with this topic in this area... the discussion really belongs elsewhere for those that are truely interested in implementing proper duplicate detection in FTNs...

    (I've crossposted to NET_DEV.)


    Bye, Wilfred.

    --- FMail-lnx64 2.1.0.18-B20170815
    * Origin: FMail development HQ (2:280/464)
  • From Digital Man to mark lewis on Thursday, April 01, 2021 13:02:22
    Re: Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: mark lewis to Wilfred van Velzen on Thu Apr 01 2021 08:33 am

    in any case, dupe checking in FTN is not done my /just/ detecting duplicate MSGIDs and rejecting the others... the header, including the time stamp, as well as the message body should be taken into account...

    Dupe checking in FTN is done via many methods - its implementation dependant. SBBSecho does not take the time stamp of the message into account when considering if a message is a duplicate.

    it should also be
    said that CRC16/CRC32 on the message bodies is also not sifficient... even with filtering out white space and the various EoLs... this because, and most programmers know this, there's a limited supply of CRC values in the tables and it is all too easy to find "hash clashes"... CRC16 has only 65536 values... CRC32 has only 4294967296 values... the "Birthday Problem" also comes into play...

    SMB uses a combination of multiple digest methods (not just CRC). They must all match (and the size) for a text string to be considered a match (e.g. duplicate).

    these days, MD5 and SHA1 are also out due to defects in them...

    You're thinking of uses in security algorithms. MD5 and SHA1 still have perfectly valid uses outside of security.

    SHA256 would
    be the first really useful algorithm or SHA512... but the real key is to filter out the stuff that can change and hash only that which won't...

    anyway, i'm done with this topic in this area... the discussion really belongs elsewhere for those that are truely interested in implementing proper duplicate detection in FTNs...

    Okay, then I guess you won't see this reply. <shrug>
    --
    digital man

    Rush quote #19:
    Rebel without a conscience, martyr without a cause
    Norco, CA WX: 78.8°F, 15.0% humidity, 0 mph SSW wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs
  • From mark lewis@1:3634/12 to Digital Man on Thursday, April 01, 2021 17:05:04
    Re: Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Digital Man to mark lewis on Thu Apr 01 2021 13:02:22


    in any case, dupe checking in FTN is not done my /just/ detecting
    duplicate MSGIDs and rejecting the others... the header,
    including the time stamp, as well as the message body should be
    taken into account...

    Dupe checking in FTN is done via many methods - its implementation dependant. SBBSecho does not take the time stamp of the message
    into account when considering if a message is a duplicate.

    yeah, i think several of us have kinda come to that conclusion... especially since the main differences between monthly echo rules postings is the message's timedate stamp and the MSGID... at least in the case of my posting
    tool, those were all that were different... it is just a PITA when someone goes offtopic and you point them to the monthly rules postings on the 1st of each month and they haven't seen them at all because the postings were
    yanked out of distribution as false-positive dupes...

    [...]

    anyway, i'm done with this topic in this area... the discussion
    really belongs elsewhere for those that are truely interested in
    implementing proper duplicate detection in FTNs...

    Okay, then I guess you won't see this reply. <shrug>

    nah, i saw it... i just didn't want to overload this area with FTN talk about dupe message detections...


    )\/(ark
    --- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
    * Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)
  • From Tracker1@TRN to Al on Monday, April 05, 2021 20:40:04
    On 3/30/2021 9:16 PM, Al wrote:
    I don't want to defeat duplicate checking. If I do disable
    duplicate message checking then I will have message checking
    based solely on MSGID?

    Have you considered appendingprepending the date-time to your autopost content?
    --
    Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com
    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Al@TRMB to Tracker1 on Tuesday, April 06, 2021 02:53:30
    Re: Re: sbbs as fidonet hub
    By: Tracker1 to Al on Mon Apr 05 2021 08:40 pm

    I don't want to defeat duplicate checking. If I do disable
    duplicate message checking then I will have message checking
    based solely on MSGID?

    Have you considered appendingprepending the date-time to your autopost content?

    On my own BBS the fact that messages are dropped doesn't concern me since we have already imported a message just like that.

    I am concerned about message flow within the networks. When a new (even if it has an identical message body but has a new msgid and time stamp) message is received it should be sent to linked nodes who may or may not have seen it already. Those nodes can decide for themselves if the message is a keeper.

    Duplicate checking is important and I don't want to defeat it. Synchronet has the best dupe checker I have encountered, and that's a good thing. It would be better (I think) if we also took into account the msgid and/or time stamp of new messages.

    My own BBS ads have a tagline so that makes each one unique and some folks add the current date to the body of their messages but folks shouldn't need to do that.

    An end node who simply consumes mail is different from a node that passes mail. A node that is passing mail needs to pass those new messages to it's linked nodes and it goes from there.

    SBBSecho has good intentions but I think it is a little to aggressive with dupes that have a different msgid and time stamp.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al

    ... It's easier to get forgiveness than permission.

    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada
  • From Deepend@RDBBS to Ragnarok on Thursday, April 08, 2021 00:05:55
    Any detailed information on using SBBS as a hub for a FTN network? I have been wondering the same thing but Either I'm not looking hard enough or the FTN tools are still too new to have good documentation for certain uses but Any information on the procedures to setup a SBBS as a Hub for a FTN network would be appreciated.

    Thanks :)

    ---
    Synchronet RetroDigital BBS - rdnetbbs.com
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@REALITY to Deepend on Thursday, April 08, 2021 07:35:00
    Deepend wrote to Ragnarok <=-

    Any detailed information on using SBBS as a hub for a FTN network? I
    have been wondering the same thing but Either I'm not looking hard
    enough or the FTN tools are still too new to have good documentation
    for certain uses but Any information on the procedures to setup a SBBS
    as a Hub for a FTN network would be appreciated.

    I don't know what information's out there, some of the tools are a bit new.

    It's possible, I'm Fidonet RC10 and a hub for Micronet. I'm using Synchronet as a mailer/areafix manager and hosting file echoes. I'm using Makenl to create the nodelist segments and it all mostly works OK.

    Before this setup, I used Argus as a mailer, Allfix for file processing, and sbbsecho for message area requests and mail tossing.

    The only thing missing at this point, and I need to look into it more, is passthrough requests for file areas. I don't carry a lot of them, and would like to have the ability to pass on file echoes without hosting them.

    The wiki entries on binkit and tickit are pretty good. Nodelist support in Echocfg gets a little tricky if you're a hub for more than one network.

    The #synchronet IRC channel on DOVEnet is a good place to ask for help when you're setting things up. I'm usually on tilde.club lately, I'm currently going through a #trivia phase... :)


    ... How did you find this place?
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Ragnarok@DOCKSUD to poindexter FORTRAN on Thursday, April 08, 2021 21:22:40
    El 8/4/21 a las 11:35, poindexter FORTRAN escribió:
    Deepend wrote to Ragnarok <=-

    De> Any detailed information on using SBBS as a hub for a FTN network? I
    De> have been wondering the same thing but Either I'm not looking hard
    De> enough or the FTN tools are still too new to have good documentation
    De> for certain uses but Any information on the procedures to setup a SBBS
    De> as a Hub for a FTN network would be appreciated.

    I don't know what information's out there, some of the tools are a bit new.

    It's possible, I'm Fidonet RC10 and a hub for Micronet. I'm using Synchronet as a mailer/areafix manager and hosting file echoes. I'm using Makenl to create the nodelist segments and it all mostly works OK.

    Very good, I'm thinking of being a hub.
    I am missing the part about using makeNL, but the documentation confuses
    me a bit, (unfortunately there is no documentation in Spanish yet)

    Can you share your expertise? i'm search for real world example for
    begin play with it

    Before this setup, I used Argus as a mailer, Allfix for file processing, and sbbsecho for message area requests and mail tossing.

    The only thing missing at this point, and I need to look into it more, is passthrough requests for file areas. I don't carry a lot of them, and would like to have the ability to pass on file echoes without hosting them.

    Using passthrough is not complicated, you have to configure in echocfg
    in each echolist it has the data of the areafix of your uplink
    and the "Forward AreaMgr Request" option to true.

    This makes the tags appear in areas.bbs with a P indicating that they
    are areas that you do not host. This works for my points


    The wiki entries on binkit and tickit are pretty good. Nodelist support in Echocfg gets a little tricky if you're a hub for more than one network.

    The #synchronet IRC channel on DOVEnet is a good place to ask for help when you're setting things up. I'm usually on tilde.club lately, I'm currently going through a #trivia phase... :)


    ... How did you find this place?
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org


    ---
    ■ Synchronet ■ Dock Sud BBS TLD 24 HS - bbs.docksud.com.ar
  • From Underminer@UNDRMINE to Deepend on Friday, April 09, 2021 05:05:57
    On 2021-04-08 1:05 a.m., Deepend wrote:
    Any detailed information on using SBBS as a hub for a FTN network? I have been
    wondering the same thing but Either I'm not looking hard enough or the FTN tools are still too new to have good documentation for certain uses but Any information on the procedures to setup a SBBS as a Hub for a FTN network would
    be appreciated.

    *waves*

    Hey Mike, long time to see. What are you wanting to do? I'm that other
    crazy Calgary guy and would be happy to help.

    ---
    Synchronet The Undermine - bbs.undermine.ca:423
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@REALITY to Ragnarok on Friday, April 09, 2021 07:31:00
    Ragnarok wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    Very good, I'm thinking of being a hub.
    I am missing the part about using makeNL, but the documentation
    confuses me a bit, (unfortunately there is no documentation in Spanish yet)

    Can you share your expertise? i'm search for real world example for
    begin play with it

    Sure. I was lucky that the previous RC had a Makenl configuration and binkd config that I could pull from.

    Using passthrough is not complicated, you have to configure in echocfg
    in each echolist it has the data of the areafix of your uplink
    and the "Forward AreaMgr Request" option to true.

    Passthrough for message echoes is straightforward. It's not supported yet
    for file areas, though - I'm guessing that may change.


    ... Abandon normal instruments
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org
  • From Deepend@RDBBS to Underminer on Friday, April 09, 2021 13:47:01
    Hey underminer. Not sure what my exact plan is yet.. but want to set something up to test and learn so I actually can do something when its needed. Pretty sure I've actually sent you netmail or something within the last month.. or atleast I thought I did.. maybe it didn't go through for some reason.


    *waves*

    Hey Mike, long time to see. What are you wanting to do? I'm that other
    crazy Calgary guy and would be happy to help.

    ---
    Synchronet The Undermine - bbs.undermine.ca:423

    ---
    Synchronet RetroDigital BBS - rdnetbbs.com
  • From Deepend@RDBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Friday, April 09, 2021 13:53:01
    I don't know what information's out there, some of the tools are a bit new.

    It's possible, I'm Fidonet RC10 and a hub for Micronet. I'm using Synchronet as a mailer/areafix manager and hosting file echoes. I'm using Makenl to create the nodelist segments and it all mostly works OK.


    If you could possibly share some more detail on how you have things setup it'd be very helpful. More detail the better if you don't mind :)

    Before this setup, I used Argus as a mailer, Allfix for file processing, and sbbsecho for message area requests and mail tossing.

    This approach is the information I have been able to find at least a tiny bit of information on.. but not enough to do anything with it.

    The only thing missing at this point, and I need to look into it more, is passthrough requests for file areas. I don't carry a lot of them, and would like to have the ability to pass on file echoes without hosting them.

    The wiki entries on binkit and tickit are pretty good. Nodelist support in Echocfg gets a little tricky if you're a hub for more than one network.

    Fairly familiar with binkit and tickit since I was using it very early in its development cycle. But only been doing basic things with it so far.

    The #synchronet IRC channel on DOVEnet is a good place to ask for help when you're setting things up. I'm usually on tilde.club lately, I'm currently going through a #trivia phase... :)

    Never hear me complain about tilde.club being where you spend your time :) Makes me happy me and ben brought tilde.club back to life :)

    ... How did you find this place?

    Had a bbs a bit prior to be coming across the tilde scene. I think generally if you can enjoy a BBS you can enjoy a tilde server :)

    ---
    Synchronet RetroDigital BBS - rdnetbbs.com
  • From Underminer@UNDRMINE to Deepend on Saturday, April 10, 2021 03:49:36
    On 2021-04-09 2:47 p.m., Deepend wrote:
    Hey underminer. Not sure what my exact plan is yet.. but want to set something
    up to test and learn so I actually can do something when its needed. Pretty sure I've actually sent you netmail or something within the last month.. or atleast I thought I did.. maybe it didn't go through for some reason.

    Well we should definitely get a direct route between our boards going
    again. And I've been off and on trying to drum up a few things and would
    like to take another swing at getting net 134 up again, and if we can do
    that then getting you setup as a/the echo hub in the net would give you
    some ability to play there. Maybe fire me an email at
    underminer@undermine.ca to start and then we'll make sure netmail can
    get back and forth.

    ---
    Synchronet The Undermine - bbs.undermine.ca:423
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@REALITY to Deepend on Saturday, April 10, 2021 07:35:00
    Deepend wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    If you could possibly share some more detail on how you have things
    setup it'd be very helpful. More detail the better if you don't mind
    :)


    I'll write something up. I did it all incrementally, so it'll be good to
    go over it all at once.



    ... Always the first steps
    --- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
    ■ Synchronet ■ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org